Post by staplehouse on Oct 13, 2010 22:05:44 GMT -5
Hi I have found something that could go further, John Thomas bap 22 july 1748, Thomas Thomas bap 23 July 1749 and James Thomas bap 5 Jan 1752 where sons of James Thomas, these three where all born at Gulval and Thomas had two son born at Gulval, thomas and Nicholas, the dates of these bap are the same mention above in one of the other replys wait your comments TJ
Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 14, 2010 5:24:15 GMT -5
My information comes from the Millett & Bolitho book of Gulval Parish Registers.
If you check the OPC site you will find it shows 1752 also.
As a matter of interest I also just had a look at IGI .......... and they show it as 1753!
IGI is therefore also incorrect!
Here is what is written in the Baptisms section of the Ludgvan PR:-
Decr 31 1751 - By an Act of Parliament made last session in order to regulate the Commencement of the Year, the Old Style ceases this day, and the first day of January is to be reckon'd the first day of the new Year for ever ..... ....... .......
Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 14, 2010 5:45:50 GMT -5
TJ - after reading your note about the Gulval baptisms I have spent a couple of hours working on this problem - Again!
I don't know that it puts us much closer to an answer but here is what I have found.
The first think I looked for was a possible marriage for James Thomas.
Based on proximity the most likely was:-
James THOMAS married Jane STONE 13th February 1737/8 at Ludgvan
Ludgvan and Gulval are adjoining Parishes and I know there was a lot of interaction so this one did look promising.
What follows is a list of children of whom most probably belong to this marriage. Included (in red) are the baptisms of the three children at Gulval.
Elizabeth bp. 27th December 1738 Ludgvan John bp. 26th October 1740 Ludgvan Edmund bp. 27th December 1744 Ludgvan Jennyfair bp. 14th December 1746 Ludgvan (private) John bp. 22nd July 1748 Gulval Mary bp. 19th February 1748/9 Ludgvan Thomas bp. 23rd July 1749 Gulval Christian bp. 30th November 1751 Ludgvan James bp. 5th January 1752 Gulval son of James Thomas sojourner Jane bp. 2nd February 1754 Ludgvan Margaret bp. 16th June 1754 Ludgvan Dorcas bp. 22nd August 1756 Ludgvan William bp. 29th May 1758 Ludgvan
There is a definite problem with this list.
If you take a close look you will see there a number of baptisms very close together - particularly in the area between 1748 and 1752.
This just happens to be when the three baptisms occurred at Gulval.
And I could also not find a burial for the first John.
This means then that the three Gulval children cannot belong to the same family.
It would therefore be safe to eliminate the 1737 marriage to Jane Stone.
Looking not much further afield and I have come across something that might be a little more promising but once again I can give no guarantees.
There are two baptisms at St Hilary that stood out when I checked the register.
William son of James and Catherine Thomas bp. 23rd June 1745 James son of James and Catherine Thomas bp. 15th June 1755
These are the only two baptisms at St Hilary for this couple and, given they are 10 years apart, it is suggestive.
I then checked for a possible marriage and found this one:-
James THOMAS married Catherine PENGELLEY 2nd March 1744/5 at BREAGE
There are a few points to be noted here.
1. Breage borders with St Hilary 2. there are no children to James and Catherine baptised at Breage 3. if earlier work on your family is correct then Thomas and Elizabeth baptised several children at St Hilary
So the family 'might' be:-
James THOMAS m. Catherine PENGELLEY 2nd March 1744/5 Breage
William bp. 23rd June 1745 St Hilary John bp. 22nd July 1748 Gulval Thomas bp. 23rd July 1749 Gulval James bp. 5th January 1752 Gulval James bp. 15th June 1755 St Hilary
I have not yet found a burial for the first James (1752) and there may well be more children baptised elsewhere.
But this is certainly a 'workable' scenario and is probably the best we have arrived at so far.
Just a word--- I have the sneaking suspicion, more with IGI, but also with other transcriptions that the Old-New Calendar may be causing problems. As a rule I do NOT change the dates that I find on the basis of it would be too much faffing around and I prefer to leave the records as they are with a note if it causes difficulty. I think that some transcribers may have converted dates in the past automatically and this may cause the problem. When you find a record on IGI you don't know if it's OC or NC as it doesn't state it so it can be confusing- especially with "unsourced" records.
Another thing- these are baptism dates NOT birth dates and although a lot of them do seem to be around the time of birth, not all are!
Post by staplehouse on Oct 15, 2010 3:41:13 GMT -5
Hi CT with reference to you information on James Thomas and catherine Pengelley I found that James was christen on the 8 Aril 1719 at Helston, his father being William Thomas but no mention of a mother, For all other information it is what I have been given so I say that we could be on the right track