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Post by Cornish Terrier on Jul 26, 2010 9:34:14 GMT -5
Have a little patience TJ. We are not dealing with an easy family here given the amount of them and the use of common names was rampant which makes things even more difficult. And it may well be that some of your Thomas people are not related to each other at all. We have run into trouble with your William Thomas because he seems to have been the only child of his parents (Thomas and Elizabeth) baptised at Zennor. Checking back on my records and it appears all his other children were baptised at St Hilary. This is based on a 'tentative reconstruction' but all the information I have so far seems to indicate this must be the case. What needs to be done now is to see if perhaps any of the family were buried or married at St Hilary to try and gather some more information. Thomas Thomas and Elizabeth Quick married at Ludgvan and it is now reasonable to assume that Elizabeth was baptised at Ludgvan in 1745 daughter of Richard and Elizabeth Quick. With most children being baptised at St Hilary it suggests Thomas may more likely be from that area so I don't know why he would baptise son William at Zennor. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Jul 26, 2010 9:47:11 GMT -5
The following is a potential match for Elizabeth:-
Elizabeth Thomas age 50 buried 2nd December 1796 at Ludgvan
The age would be right for Elizabeth Quick and Ludgvan would be logical if she were 'brought home' to be buried.
But the amount of people named Elizabeth Thomas makes it very difficult just yet to be able to say whether this is your Elizabeth.
CT
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Post by staplehouse on Jul 27, 2010 23:25:19 GMT -5
Hi I have done a bit more research, with something to go on and found that Elizabeth Quick was baptism on the 26 January 1745 to parents Richard and Elizabeth Row she also had two others sister, Jane, and Anne,1748-1831 Elizabeth and Thomas Thomas also had two other sons, beside William, Thomas Thomas born 18 th June 1775 and Nicholas Thomas born28 December 1776 and on in 1811 he married Mary Anne Marrack this is what I found. Pleae correct me if not TJ
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Jul 28, 2010 8:58:07 GMT -5
Partially correct TJ. Elizabeth Quick had those two sisters as well as two brothers. Eldest brother William was mentioned in two Wills of which one he was made executor but no baptism has been found for him. There was also a younger brother Richard who married Jane Baragwanath at St Hilary in 1781. I still suspect St Hilary is very much connected with Thomas and Elizabeth. The two brothers you mentioned for Thomas Thomas were baptised at Gulval. But I believe it probable that the following were also children of Thomas and Elizabeth:- Richard bp. 10th June 1781 St Hilary s/o Thomas and Elziabeth James bp. 11th January 1784 St Hilary s/o Thomas and Elizabeth Anne bp. 9th July 1786 St Hilary d/o Thomas and Elizabeth There appears to be no other marriage that would account for these three so I think they do belong to your family. A possible link to Zennor (and a reason William may have been baptised there) is that Elizabeth's sister Ann was at Zennor with her husband John Davy. You mentioned a marriage in 1881 for Nicholas Thomas to Mary Ann Marrack. I do not believe this is anything to do with your particular Thomas family. There was a Nicholas Thomas s/o William and Elizabeth baptised at Paul in 1783 and it was at Paul that the aforementioned marriage occurred. At least two children from the marriage of Nicholas Thomas and Mary Ann Marrack had MATTHEWS as part of their name - Elizabeth Matthews Thomas in 1816 and George Matthews Marrack Thomas in 1819. I believe Mary Ann Marrack was the daughter of Philip Marrack and Mary MATTHEWS who married at Paul in 1781. CT
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Post by staplehouse on Jul 28, 2010 23:29:57 GMT -5
Hi CT I was going by the IGI with relation to Nicholas and Mary Ann marriage where it stated he was the son of Thomas and Elizabeth Thomas at Gulval TJ all this is great as this better than what I was trying to marry all the other Thomas to mine which would not work. Just would be great to find out who Thomas Thomas father was??
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Jul 29, 2010 1:27:07 GMT -5
TJ - I cannot find the reference in IGI to Nicholas Thomas being son of Thomas and Elizabeth so must assume then that it is through Ancestral File or something similar connected to IGI. Be very wary of anything in IGI that does not have a batch number beginning with 'C' or 'P' for Baptisms and 'M' for Marriages. ('E' can also be found for Baptisms) Those letters represent entries that have been extracted from Parish registers and anything else is generally Member Submitted. And I find a lot of that stuff is pure conjecture or just plain 'made up' to fit a particular scenario. Occasionally they are right but more often than not you are being led straight down the long garden path. As I said the Thomas name is far from an easy one to work with so it will take time and patience to get to the answer of the identity of your Thomas. CT
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Post by staplehouse on Jul 29, 2010 3:11:39 GMT -5
Hi Ct Thank you for that I will keep that in mind, I have been up the long garden path and do not want to go there again, so I will wait for you with more information, I trust you as you known what you are looking for and have the places to go to research. Thank you for giving me all that you have it is much appreicated. TJ
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Post by smamf on Jul 31, 2010 5:05:28 GMT -5
Hi I am new to this site and I am excited about the information posted here, just going through it all to see what relates to my research. Quite a while ago someone mentioned a Pedigree of the Thomas Family covering 8 generations starting from Matthew THOMAS 1713-1793 of Treen. It was compiled in 1922 by Gilbert Anderson. It covers 5 A3 sheets and appears to be quite comprehensive. However, there appears to be some deviation from what has been discussed on this forum, eg it states that John is the eldest son of Matthew and Ann, and he married Mary THOMAS in 1762. I also seem to recall that there was some confusion over the Nicholas CHRISTOPHERS and Charitys. I think what I am saying is that I have it here, if anyone wants me to forward any details, but I cannot be sure of its' accuracy. S
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Post by marychown on Jul 31, 2010 6:51:46 GMT -5
Hello there and welcome!
I believe that some time ago I mentioned the tree of Matthew Thomas and Ann Roberts which was drawn up in 1922 by Gilbert Anderson. I would greatly welcome any information that you have on this family, as I myself am a great-great-granddaughter of Catherine Thomas (1812-1894) who married William Nicholls of Kerrow, Zennor at St. Levan on 6 Feb 1836. Catherine Thomas was the daughter of Hannibal Thomas (1771-1853) and Jane Quick, Hannibal being the son of John and Mary Thomas who married at Zennor on 8 June 1762. I do remember seeing a copy of what must have been this tree many years ago and copying down relevant information from it regarding the names of the children of Matthew and Ann Thomas, John and Mary Thomas and Hannibal Thomas and Jane Quick as well as my own line from then down.
I know that the tree states that John was the eldest son of Matthew and Ann but no baptism can be found for a son called John for this couple. However, there is a daughter called Mary baptised at Zennor on 25 Aug 1741) and she appears to be the Mary Thomas who married John Thomas (son of Hannibal Thomas and Charity Stephens). The tree's information giving John as the son of Matthew and Ann Thomas greatly confused me for a very long time. Then I came across John Thomas's will.
John Thomas (born 1737) left a will dated 4 July 1794 and proven 1804 in which he writes:
'ALSO I give and bequeath unto my dear wife Mary Thomas nine pounds a year to pay the rent for the estate we now live on during her father MATTHEW THOMAS and her mother's lives time and after their decease there to be paid three pounds a year by my Executrix after my decease'.
It must surely be the case that, despite what the tree drawn up in 1922 by Gilbert Anderson shows, it was Mary Thomas (who was the daughter of Matthew and Ann Thomas) who married John Thomas (who was most likely the son of Hannibal Thomas and Charity Stephens) and who was a cousin.
My great-great grandfather William Nicholls (baptised Zennor 10 June 1809) who married Catherine Thomas was the son of Richard Nicholls and Elizabeth Christopher who were married at Zennor on 8 Aug 1801. Elizabeth was the daughter of Nicholas Christopher and Charity Thomas who were married at Zennor on 11 May 1767.
You are dead right. The Thomas and Christopher families of Zennor are very difficult to sort out as so many of their children were baptised with the same christian names.
All the best,
Regards,
Mary
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Post by staplehouse on Jul 31, 2010 15:51:36 GMT -5
Mary Is this these Thomas any connection to mine, see above details, as I am confuse on where to go from here, wait your reply TJ
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Post by marychown on Jul 31, 2010 23:46:00 GMT -5
TJ
I know how you feel about trying to piece together all the information regarding the Thomas family of Zennor. It is all so very frustrating. I will contact you directly and see if I can help at all.
Regards,
Mary
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Aug 12, 2010 0:05:28 GMT -5
TJ - not sure how much this might help our little problem but it needs to be thrown into the mix.
When Thomas THOMAS married Elizabeth QUICK at Ludgvan in 1774 both were recorded specifically as being of that Parish.
Thomas was a husbandman and must have been resident of the Parish for some time and perhaps even born there.
One witness was Francis Jennings who witnessed quite a number of marriages and was possibly the Clerk. The other was John Baragwanath but there is nothing to indicate whether he might be related, be a friend or simply have been 'available' to witness the marriage.
Thomas also signed with his 'mark' which looks like a large lower-case 'm'.
Not much but it is something we did not have before.
CT
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Post by staplehouse on Aug 13, 2010 6:04:19 GMT -5
Hi CT at least that is a bit more than we knew before, TJ
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Post by staplehouse on Oct 13, 2010 1:15:34 GMT -5
Hi CT have you got any other information regarding these thomas yet TJ
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 13, 2010 3:00:27 GMT -5
TJ - unfortunately nothing new has surfaced. I have even tried searching Marriage entries in the years surrounding when Thomas and Elizabeth were married to see if I could find evidence of Thomas being a witness. And then I tried to find marriages for his other children in the hope that 1. I would have copies of the PRs and 2. that he was a witness. The idea was to try and pin him down a little more to one place. But nothing has come of it so far. CT
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