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Post by tonymitch on Feb 9, 2008 20:16:16 GMT -5
Hi...I have an interesting question...(I hope!)  G-Grandma Elizabeth Williams married William Furze in Towednack in 1860. In the 1901 census she is a widow living in Fore St St Just in the house of a man called John Leggoe. I can't find where she was born because her name 'Williams' is not uncommon and her age in 1901 does not compute with her age at marriage. She was born in either 1841 or 1843. In 1903 she left UK and went to S. Africa.  Family tradition says she left to nurse soldiers in the Boer War which ended in 1902. ;D (Our family always were a bit slow) However, I think she went to visit a brother. She was known locally as 'Nurse Furze' and should not be confused with her daughter Elizabeth who was also known as 'Nurse Furze'!  Family tradition states again (and we all know how reliable family tradition can be) that she was one of the first 'graduates' of the Penzance school of Nursing. Any info on either her sojourn in S. Africa (she went to Capetown) would be appreciated.  Tony M |
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Post by londoner on Feb 10, 2008 8:36:52 GMT -5
Hi TOny I Cant help with the SA end but have found a possible family: 1851 Sancreed John Williams 1820 Sancreed Elizabeth Williams 1814 Sancreed Jamima Williams 1837 Sancreed John Williams 1840 Towednack Johanna Williams 1842 Sancreed Elizabeth Williams 1843 Zennor Margaret Williams 1845 Towednack Elizabeth Green 1846 Madron "daughter in law"  According to the BMD she was Elizabeth Jane when married (v5c p505)and there is a birth 1st quarter 1844 (v9.p268) for Elizabeth Jane. Her marriage or birth Cert would confirm father's name. |
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Post by cornishmaid on Feb 10, 2008 13:39:36 GMT -5
No help here either with the SA end of things I'm afraid  However, I've found William and Elizabeth Furze through the 1861, 1871 and 1881 census returns, and on each one the age for Elizabeth equates to a birth year of 1843/1844. All the returns state she was born in Towednack. In the 1861 census she is just down as Elizabeth Furze, but in the 1871 and 1881 she is "Elizabeth J" Furze. In the record for her marriage to William Furze Elizabeth is listed as "Elizabeth Jane Williams". (June Qtr, 1860, Penzance district, Volume 5c, Page 505.) Having searched for her birth the only Elizabeth Jane Williams I can find for the right time period is March quarter of 1844, Penzance District, Volume 9, Page 268. I can't find any other Elizabeth Williams of the right age for the 1851 census except the one Londoner has mentioned above. You say her age at marriage doesn't equate to her age on the 1901 census? Do you have the marriage certificate? Thanks for another of your postings, they always make me smile |
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Feb 10, 2008 14:10:30 GMT -5
Tony - I have created a note (including a full copy of your latest) to send to one of my contacts in South Africa.
(Have tried a couple of times now to send it but it seems I still have some technical problems happening).
However - the note will get through and I am hoping that Sha may be able to find some information for you regarding that South African connection.
Will let you know when I get a response.
Ian
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Post by tonymitch on Feb 10, 2008 20:52:10 GMT -5
Elizabeh "J" Furze is almos certainly the correct person. "www.ancestorson board.com" lists her as leaving London Capebound in 1903 aged 59 = birthdate of 1844. The 1901 census confirms this giving her age as 58 = birth date of 1843/44. However, she was married in 1860 with a given age of 19 = birth date of 1841. I supect that she may have only been 16 when she married and her first child Elizabeth Jane Furze was born that year in Madron. (Naughty naughty G-Grandmama??)
As I said, my family always were a bit slow...."any info on EITHER her sojourn in S.Africa...would be appreciated"...What I meant to say was any info on either her sojourn in S Africa, or info about graduates from the Pezance School of Nursing would be appreciated.
Thanks
Tony M
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Feb 11, 2008 9:20:34 GMT -5
Tony - as mentioned in a posting on another section of the Board I am attempting to contact some people in South Africa who may be able to help.
Once 'the cavalry' arrives I will let you know the results.
Avenues are still open and I will keep trying for you until I get some sort of response.
Ian
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Post by tonymitch on Feb 14, 2008 6:32:12 GMT -5
Thanks folks.
I note two other Elizabeth Jane Willaims's...one in Scilly Isles and the other in Halsown, but I'm quite prepared to believe Elizabeth Jane from Penzance Area is the one....(family tradition, this time coming from the States says that she came from Pendeen area.) I am assuming her date of birth was 1843 as per census not 1841 as per marriage. Incidentally, these Williams's must have had something going for them...."John Williams 1820; Elizabeth Williams 1814; first child in 1837" This means John was 17 and Elizabeth 23 when Jamima was born (Naughty naughty g-g-grandad??) and we think 'Toy Boys' are a recent innovation!
One thing I forgot to mention was that Elizabeth J Furze returned from S. Africa to this country and I believe, yet to be confirmed, (again family tradition...this time from my Dad) died and was burried in Atherton Lancashire where she went to live with her daughter, my grandma.
There is an allegedly 'true' story about a chunk of gold she brought back from SA so presumably she was living in the gold mining area. It's a truly romantic tale of ravaging Boers, premature underground childbirth and a relieved mine manager...but as we know, Elizabeth arived well over twelve months too late to take part in the War so it is presumably another of my many spurious 'family traditions'.
Tony M
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Post by londoner on Feb 14, 2008 12:16:02 GMT -5
Here we have an interesting scenario:  Sancreed 1837 11 Apr Jemima c/o Elizabeth Rowe, Single Woman of Poor House, private baptism, base child Sancreed 23 Dec 1841 by Banns William Green 35 Miner of Madron [Mark] (Father: Cornelius Green, Miller) Elizabeth Rowe 27 of Tregeras [Mark] (Father: Benjamin Rowe, Miner) Witnesses: Samuel Ivey, John Grenfell Sancreed 1842 15 May Johannah c/o William (Miner) & Elizabeth Green of Lower Tregeras Sancreed 5 May 1849 by Banns John Williams full age widower Miner of Tregerras [Mark] (Father: Philip Williams, Miner) Elizabeth Green full age of Tregerras [Mark] (Father: Benjamin Rowe, Miner) This would explain why Jemima & Johanna are listed in 1851 as from Sancreed and John, Elizabeth & Margaret from T'wednack or Zennor. Unfortunately doesn't tell us who John's first wife (& mother of these children) was |
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Post by tonymitch on Feb 14, 2008 19:29:32 GMT -5
Thanks Londoner Yes, seems to be a very interesting scenario, let's get this straight. 1. Elizabeth Rowe has a daughter Jemima in 1837 2. Elizabeth marries William Green in 1841 3. Elizabeth and Wiliam have a daughter Johannah in 1842 4. William dies ?? 5. Elizabeth marries John Williams in 1849 6. g-grandmama Elizabeth born to John and Elizabeth 1843 six years before the marriage! !! Hell no....it doesn't work does it!!! and there's an elder 'Williams' brother too. Congratulations *******. This certainly gives me something to ponder, but I must go on record and appologise to g-g-grandad for my intemperate comment about 'toy boys' and 17yr old youths fathering children....as if they would.....the very thought  !!!!!! Tony M |
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Post by londoner on Feb 15, 2008 5:02:08 GMT -5
significant point is that when John married Elizabeth he was a widower so your Elizabeth's mother was his first wife - I haven't found that marriage - presumably at Zennor or Towednack. But I have just found them in 1841 at Wheal Sandwich(?) Amalveor Towednack Elizabeth Williams 20 (yet another Elizabeth!!!) John Williams 20 John Williams 10 Mo |
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Post by tonymitch on Feb 15, 2008 7:19:43 GMT -5
Great....another Elizabeth....I'll be able to list her along with my 13 James Mitchells !! Fortunately the women all change surnames, but which Elizabeth will we be talking about in the future? Nurse Furze Elizabeth Snr, Jnr or one of the Williams' Elizabeths. By the way, do you have the census on CD or do you use internet? If the latter, which web site do you think is best?
Tony M
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Post by londoner on Feb 15, 2008 9:58:26 GMT -5
Cornwall Online Census Project has quite a lot. See PM for other stuff
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Feb 21, 2008 15:52:06 GMT -5
Lesley and Tony - G'day! Had more problems as you will have noticed and there are more to come.  However - I have just read your latest conversations with interest and look forward to further updates. My one contribution for now is that, being back on line again for a while, I have now become a subscriber to another South African Genealogy Board. My first contact was unable to help and advised me of two further Lists to join. I sent a copy of your (Tony) note to both and have now had correspondence from the East Cape List. Okay Tony - here is a copy of the first reply. Hope there is something here to help you and I will be keeping things going as best I can to try and help you out. Ian |
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Feb 21, 2008 17:02:44 GMT -5
Tony - a new email just arrived with a little further information.
See how you get on with that and we will pursue it further as required.
Ian
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Post by tonymitch on Feb 22, 2008 4:55:17 GMT -5
Thanks Ian,
Did she go twice? I already had the date of the 1903 trip but I wonder if the 1906 one was my Elizabeth or another? What would interest me is when she returned and what did she do over there. Is there any truth about her chunk of gold (see board for 14th Feb reply #6)? She had two rings made out of it and I am wearing one. I don't think the rest of the Furze listed are directly related. The majority of Elizabeth's children emegrated to USA Colorado/S. Dakota. Dr Todd in "The Cornish Miner in America" has a good report of them. However, (according to family tradition/myth and we all know how reliable that is) Elizabeth's husband William had possibly been married before and one source (90+ years old in USA) maintains that William had 15 chidren in total.
Thanks again
Tony M
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Family tradition says she left to nurse soldiers in the Boer War which ended in 1902. ;D (Our family always were a bit slow) However, I think she went to visit a brother. She was known locally as 'Nurse Furze' and should not be confused with her daughter Elizabeth who was also known as 'Nurse Furze'! 
!!!!!!