The Christopher Trewhella Debacle

[Zenobia]

Christopher Cock of Helston, in his will, written 1678, names grandchildren Charles, Thomas, Matthew and David Trewhella. His will is witnessed by a Christopher Trewhella, who is also later a witness to a number of land documents involving Christopher Cock's sons.

Christopher Trewhella is presumed to be Christoher Cock's son-in-law.

Charles Trewhella, son of Christopher, married Margery Luke in Camborne in 1686 and had a number of children. Charles was probably born ca. 1660 and named for the returning sovereign, Charles II.

A Court Leet for Amyll & Trill, held in 1688 includes the name of a Christopher Trewhella.

In 1691 and 1693 a Christopher Trewhella had 2 children chr. in Wendron parish, which is right next to Helston, the residence of Christopher Cock. The wife's given name at one of the chr. is Mary.

So....do we have one Christopher, or two?

When Chr. Cock wrote his will, he mentioned no grandson Christopher Trewhella, and if he was born after 1678, he would be too young to have children in 1691 and 1693. Yet the Helston/Wendron proximity would certainly seem to indicate a connection - in other words, this is not just some random Christopher Trewhella showing up there. Could this be C. Cock's son-in-law with a second marriage?

And is this the same person who was associated with Amyll & Trill? C. Cock, altho' being associated with Helton, also owned property in St. Erth, where one of his daughters married, and his son Thomas resided in Lelant. So the possible association with a son-in-law to Towednack is not unlikely.

To make matters more complex, Martin Trewhella, son of Thomas of Towednack named a son Christopher. I had previously assumed that the Amyll & Trill Christopher was an uncle, but now it looks more and more to me that there may have only been ONE Christopher.

Since C.Cock's son-in-law named sons Mathew and Thomas, we need to rethink the Towednack connection....

Could Christopher Trewhella have been a son of the Matthew Trewhella who appears on the 1641 Protestation Return for Towednack?

Could Thomas Trewhella (m. Catherine Boswin) have also been a son of this Matthew, and not of James as we previously thought....?

Lots of new possibilities here!

[Cornish Terrier]

CRIKEY - Another can of worms you have opened!

OK, I will forget the Trewolla lot for a short time as it is late and they are getting very confusiing with all the varying data supplied.

Let me through yet another 'spanner in the works' for you regarding Christopher Trewhella. ;D

Christopher TREWHELLA, (Gent.)
m. Wendron February 9th, 1685
Eleanor COLLINS

Eleanor was daughter of George COLLINS, Gent. of Helston who left a Will in 1686.

George COLLINS had five daughters that I am aware of - Eleanor m. Christopher TREWHELLA, Katherine, Loveday, Mary and Elizabeth m. Francis TREMENHEERE.

From IGI (many years ago) I determined the possibility that Francis TREMENHEERE was bp. Helston 28 July 1652 as son of Francis and Mary.

One might expect that Elizabeth COLLINS was possibly of similar age given her father's 1686 Will naming her as already married.

An interesting Marriage at Helston is:-

Georgius COLLINES m. Elizabetha TREVETHAN 23 October 1639

AND:-

Petrus COLLYN m. Elizabetha TREMENHYER 19 February 1600

NEXT:- you mentioned the baptisms of two children at Wendron to Christopher Trewhella (1691 and 1693) and you also mentioned that the mother was named as MARY in one of these events.

My records show that both children were baptised at Wendron with NO mention of the mother's name.

I have a note for daughter Elenor TREWEELA bp. 1693:-
"The entry in the transcriipt also does not give the mother's name whilst IGI records her as being 'Mary'."

Iin 1711 at Wendron a Chistopher Treweela married Mary Haiins and, although I am yet to find a baptism for him, I believe he is probably the son of Christopher and Eleanor.

With his wife being Mary it is possible this has reflected back to the IGI records via the submitter.

Christopher and Mary had children - George, Christopher, Mary and Thomas bp. 1711-1720.

Interesting burials at Helston:-

16 Sep 1719 - Mr. Christopher Treweela
09 Apr 1764 - Christopher Treweela

There is much more here than meets the eye I am thinking!

Christopher Cock named his four Trewhella grandchildren but did not mention the name of their mother - suggesting she was already deceased.
Christopher Trewhella was involved in the Will suggesting he was the son-in-law and, therefore, father of the four Trewhella grandsons.
Christopher Cocks Will was written in 1678.

Therefore it is quite likely that the Christopher Trewhella who married Eleanor Collins is one and the same man.

I believe that, at this time in history, we are dealing with just one man named Christopher Trewhella and that he would have been born sometime in the 1620's or 1630's.

I will cogitate no further right now as I am extremely tired.
But I will leave you with those thoughts and simply add that I do not believe, at this tiime, that Christopher could have been son of the Matthew of 1641.

Eagerly awaiting your next.

[Zenobia]

Excellent additions and I thank you for that....

The IGI entry for Elenor being the daughter of Christopher and Mary is taken directly from the parish register extract. However, it could certainly be a mistake on the part of the clerk or the transcriber.

I do agree that there is only one Christopher (but wanted your opinion), and that he was the one involved with Amyll & Trill. It had not occurrred to me that Christopher's wife may already have been dead when Christopher Cock wrote his will, but looking a the will again, this makes perfect sense, since he names his other 4 living daughters.

So we have Christopher marrying a _____ Cock in the very late 1650s, begetting Charles probably ca. 1660-2, and three other sons by about 1670-2. By 1678 his first wife is dead, and he remarries in 1686 to Ellinor Collins and has two more chldren.

I also agree that the Christopher who marries Mary Haines is his son by his second marriage.

It looks like he loses his three younger sons by Ms Cock at an early age; obviously Thomas, since he reuses the name, and the other two (Mathew and David) cannot be identified elsewhere.

In 1688 he is involved with Amyll & Trill in Towednack.

My big question now is: "Why do you believe him not to be a son of Mathew Trewhella?" We know that Matthew existed, and was alive and well in 1641. I had tentatively given Matthew a birthdate of about 1610, and placed him as an elder brother of James and Thomas, all sons of James the Churchwarden at Towednack.

Now we would figure that Christopher Trewhella is born in the early to mid 1630s. (I would not place him earlier with a death in 1719). We have James' children stretched out from 1607 to 1630. If Christopher is not a son of Mathew, then it would be likely he is the youngest child of James. Certainly the fact that he named sons Mathew and Thomas seems to indicate an affiliation with this family. There were a few other groups of rogue Trewhellas about, but they were not using "Mathew"...

I do find it interesting however, that neither our Thomas, nor this Christopher named a son James...

That is why I am proposing that both may have been sons of Matthew... Of course it blows our mermaid theory out of the water...

Incidentally, I think I might have a theory of the unconventional Trewhella name of "David" for Christopher's youngest son by his first wife. In 1661 Christopher's sister-in-law, Margery Cock married David Ninnes. I suspect David Trewhella may have been named for his uncle, who was quite probably his godparent.

[Cornish Terrier]

While I am thinking about this I will throw in a couple of items as I find them:-

Helston Marriages
20 Feb 1608 John COCK m. Florance PENHILLICK
8 Jun 1612 Thomas COCK m. An PHILLIP
21 Jun 1612 Mary COCKE m. William WILLIAMS
15 Jan 1615 Alexander COCK m. Mary SQUYRE
24 Jul 1626 Chraforus COCKE m. Jana PENHELLICKE ***
2 Feb 1627 Johes COCKE m. Bethsheba ODGER
28 Nov 1629 Willimus COCKE m. Allicea THOMAS

There are more later on but this lot will suffice for now.

27 May 1647 James TREWOOLA m. Jane LANYON

That is one that has always intrigued me.

Later on there are TREWOLLA marriages but this last indicates possibly the name of TREWEELA.

Helston Baptisms
8 May 1606 Pedritus s/o Thome COCK
31 Dec 1607 William s/o Thomas COCK
12 Sep 1609 Robecka d/o Thomas COCK

There are other children baptised to Thomas, John and Alexander Cock up to 1626 where we find the baptism of Jane to Christopher Cock.

22 Nov 1626 Jana d/o Christopher COCKE


Burials
23 Nov 1617 Thomas s/o Thomas COCK

It is interesting that I could not find the burial of Christopher Cock at Helston in 1679. - But then I just noticed there is a gap between 1676 and 1683 in the Transcript.

But how about this:-

9 Dec 1683 Mrs Jane COCKE, wid. (from the BT) *** ;D

And another of interest

1 May 1692 Christopher s/o Mr Robert COCK
30 Aug 1706 Christopher s/o Mr Thomas COCK

Pity I don't currently have access to a couple of other Parishes of interest.

Anyway - enough of this one for now while I have a break and get back to your main note.

[Cornish Terrier]

There is a lot more to this than you have realised dear Cousin!

I am still trying to come up with a legitimate reason for the origins of Christopher but, in the meantime, will give you another little tidbit.

You mentioned that the three younger children of Christopher Trewhella and () Cock died at a young age (probably) and I can see some of your reasoning.

BUT - Probate Indexes list the following Will:-

David TREWHELA, St Sidwell, Devon - 1741

This Will was included in a book of Devonshire Wills and Admons (published 1908) proved at the Archdeaconery Court.

I believe this to be the same David Trewhella but, unfortunately, it would seem his Will is no longer extant due to the Wartime Bombing of Exeter.

This would be the only David Trewhella (var.) that I know of until the 19th/20th Centuries so my assumption is that it is most probably the same man.

But - Will left in 1741 means that, being mentioned in a 1678 Will, he must be at least 63 years old at death.
If we put his age at 70-75 then he is born sometime between 1665-1670 or thereabouts - which is quite feasible.

This would also work with first named brother Charles being the man who married Margery Luke in 1686.

Brothers Thomas and Matthew I am yet to determine but I would not go with the suggestion that they died young - at this stage - as there is insufficient evidence.

Now - as for neither Christopher nor Thomas naming a son James.
It is possible that one, or other, or both, did name a son James with neither surviviing.

We also need to throw in the name of MARTIN who is my own direct ancestor and deemed to be son of Thomas and Katherine.
Where did that name spring from.

As for Matthew of the 1641 Protestation Return at Towednack:-
This is the only reference I have ever found for him except for the possibility his name was used 'in memorium' by other members of his family (cousins included).

I have spoken to Nancy again about an idea I had ( )

You may remember me telling you some years ago that the Benchend from Towednack Church had been stolen.
This was the one with James Trewhela, Churchwarden, carved on one end and Matthew Trenwith on the other and was dated 1633.

My query was that, should the item have been retrieved, would it be possible to do a carbon date test on it and make a comparison with the Mermaid Pew at Zennor Church which relates to the legend of Matthew Trewhella and the Mermaid.

I am still of the opinion that it is ecxtremely possible that the Matthew Trewhella we have been discussing may also be the bloke iinvolved in the Mermaid Mystery.

And - to digress a little - it must also be remembered that Christopher Trewhella is mostly known around Helston and Wendron and might also have been involved at Cury.
He did turn up at Towednack and St Ives and has obvious connections (of some sort) to the Trewhella families in those areas at the time.

But it must also be remembered that there were other members of the Trewhella family from ST ERTH who appear to have stayed there or ventured elsewhere.

e.g. - A book called 'Early Stuart Mariners' names a William Trewhela at RINSEY in the early 1600's. (This is off the top of my head but is pretty much correct.)

Rinsey is down near the coast around Breage and Helston.

Will try to search out more on this in the coming days.

Time for Tucker and then Bed!

[Zenobia]

Thanks for all the additional.

I have all the needful Cock info from Helston. I would sure love to get hold of Wendron Records...

Christopher Cock had two younger brothers: John ca. 1607 and Thomas 1612. Whether either of them ended up at Helston I've never been able to determine. Christopher Cock did have a 'cousin' (probably nephew) William Cock at Helston in 1678.

Florence Penhellick was a distance relation of Jane Penhellick (3rd cousin or thereabouts). I just got the will of John Cock this week, and will be putting it in my next probate abstract.

The David Trewhella in Devon is very interesting, and it does seem likely that it would be Christopher's son. Where the heck is St. Sidwell?

As for Martin, maybe Thomas was a devote of Martin Luther... (more likely he just decided to be different...)

Given his Towednack connection, and his naming of children Matthew and Thomas, I would presume that Christopher went FROM Towednack to the Helston area, and not vice versa. The St. Erth and Breage bunch seemed to use completely different sets of names for their children.

The Trewhellas in St. Erth appeared to have pretty much 'daughtered out' by 1700 or earlier.

[Zenobia]

Just did a fast check in Devon.

St Sidwell is a parish in Exeter.

A Tobias Trewheller had two children (1716 and 1743) chr. at North Molton, Devon, about 25 miles from Exeter.

That is pretty much the closest I've seen in both time and place for any Devon Trewhella activity.

I wonder if David was a mariner? Apparently the city of Exeter had connections with Newfoundland, via their fisheries...

[Cornish Terrier]

As I understand it the Trewhella family went FROM St Erth TO Towednack which argues with your point.

As for Tobias at North Molton - sadly I have yet not been able to find any more than what you have via IGI.

I think this will be my last for the night so will try more tomorrow.

[Zenobia]

ianjtrewhella said:

As I understand it the Trewhella family went FROM St Erth TO Towednack which argues with your point.

I don't follow...

I simply meant that I believed that Chirstopher did not originate in the Helston area, and then on a whim, decide to go to Towednack and take up with Amalibrea; but rather, came to the Helston area, having already been established in Towednack. If that were the case, then of course he was part of the family that migrated from St. Erth to Towednack, but they were well seated at Towednack by the time Christopher would have been old enough to strike out on his own.

As for my statement of the "St. Erth and Breage bunch" I was referring to the Trewhellas that stayed at St. Erth, as opposed to James' family, which moved on to Towednack. The ones that stayed at St. Erth did not use any of the names that became popular among the later Towednack branch (aside from the common ones like William for instance). Some of the names used by the remaining St. Erth ones were decidedly different... (Richard, Steven, Gilbert, Nathaniel, etc.). Sorry if I was unclear in my statement; I get a bit schizo when I am in a hurry to express myself...

So based on the omnastics, I simply meant that I did not believe that Chiristopher originated from the bunch that remained at St. Erth, but rather, was from the transplanted Towenack family.

Aside from that, because of the completeness of the St. Erth records and the incompletelness of the Towednack ones, it would appear that James the Churchwarden left Towednack after the birth of his daughter Anne in 1607, and basically settled in Towednack, altho' he did have one of his later children (Philipp) chr. in St. Erth (a not uncommon practice, particularly if there is still family in the home parish). Most of the known or postulated children we have for James after 1607 have no recorded christenings, presumably because they were chr. at Towednack, and the records are spotty and/or non-extant for those years. So if Christopher was the son of James, or the son of Matthew, he would almost certainly have been born at Towednack, not St. Erth.

[Zenobia]

I will try and find time to contact the OPC for St. Sidwell, and see if I can get a death entry for David Trewhella...

Incidentally, have you checked the 3 (pre WWII) volumes of published wills for Devon?

[Cornish Terrier]

G'day Again.

Appreciate your notes about Christopher but I am still not sure about him or his origins.
He obviously had connections/influence etc. with Towednack and (I think) St Ives but he mostly appears around the Helston and Wendron area where there were other (I believe) relatives.
Refer back to my notes about Cury Parish etc. and also the reference to 'Early Stuart Mariners'.

It seems to be rounding out to a 'family connection' all round but we need to be able to prove it reasonably.

The logistically located name of Christopher Trewhella should be a real hint but ...

Back to work for a short time on the 'Deeds' thread and then off to bed before I deal with the madhouse at the Pub again.

[zibetha]

I may have gotten the DNA match of a lifetime today. I match a granddaughter of Joseph Rowe born in Cornwall died in Illinois at age 104, son of Joseph Rowe and Lucy Jane Glasson. Lucy was a Clemens/Clemence as was my ancestor, Wilmot Clemence, wife of Martin Harvey. My DNA match is also a descendant of Christopher Cock the Elder on the Glasson side of her family.

She is a descendant of Ann Cock and Robert Hampton.

Zib

[Cornish Terrier]

That is certainly an excellent match and one I will try and follow up on as I get a chance over the next few days.

CT

[zibetha]

It's certainly interesting! Since my post above, I also received news that I match her father, so that is the line we're dealing with. As far as I know, I have no Glasson ancestors.

Two new Harvey family matches came in for me this week, and that gives me five close relatives who are descendants of Martin and Wilmot (and of William Harvey Sr and Ann Trewhela) whose tests are in the Ancestry database. None of them matched these two people.

Zib

[Cornish Terrier]

I will have to find time to sit down and look at this carefully so that I know exactly where each of these links are. But it does seem that we are finding connections all around but not directly connected to Christopher Trewhella.

CT