Ann THOMAS, mother of Louisa Thomas WALLACE bpt 18 Apr 1821.

[genie2]

Hello All

Who was Ann THOMAS, mother of Louisa Thomas WALLACE (or Wallis?). Louisa WALLACE m. John ROWE in the Mar Qtr 1840, in Madron - England Select Marriages 1538-1973 - Vol 9 page 255.

Louisa Thomas WALLACE is a half sister to Henry ROACH (the Capt. of the Burra Burra Mines in SA after being in Bolivia).

Any help appreciated.

Glenys

[londoner]

Jul 17, 2022 1:41:05 GMT -5 genie2 said:

Hello All

Who was Ann THOMAS, mother of Louisa Thomas WALLACE (or Wallis?). Louisa WALLACE m. John ROWE in the Mar Qtr 1840, in Madron - England Select Marriages 1538-1973 - Vol 9 page 255.

Louisa Thomas WALLACE is a half sister to Henry ROACH (the Capt. of the Burra Burra Mines in SA after being in

Glenys

Louisa was baptised at Madron, Penzance 18 April 1821 parents Robert and Nancy . Robert
Wallis and Nancy Thomas married at Madron 3 August 1820
Nancy is a common alternative for Ann. I have not yet identified which Robert Wallis was Louisa's father or Nancy's family.

[londoner]

Do the Australian Records for Captain Henry Roach mention his mother? It seems unlikely that he would be baptised in St Ives, Henry Roach Thomas, as the illegitimate son of Ann Thomas if he was as all the records I have seen state, born in Redruth. Do you have any evidence that this AnnThomas was the Nancy Thomas, mother of Louisa?

[genie2]

OPC Baptisms database
Day Month 18-Apr
Year 1821
Parish Circuit Or Chapel Madron, Penzance Chapelry
Forename Louisa Thomas
Surname WALLACE
Sex dau
Age Or Date Of Birth
Father Forename Robert
Mother Forename Nancy
Residence Penzance
Parish
Status Or Occupation labourer
Where Baptised
Notes
Transcriber Notes
Transcriber S E Shaw/M Cordrey

OPC Marriages database
Day Month 03-Aug
Year 1820
Parish Circuit Or Chapel Madron
Groom Fn Robert
Groom Sn WALLIS
Groom Age
Groom Residence otp
Groom Condition bachelor
Groom Rank Profession
Groom Signed / Marked (S/M) S
Groom Father Name
Groom Father Rank Profession
Bride Fn Nancy
Bride Sn THOMAS
Bride Age
Bride Residence otp
Bride Condition spinster
Bride Rank Profession
Bride Signed / Marked (S/M) M
Bride Father Name
Bride Father Rank Profession
Banns / Licence (B/L) Banns
Witness Fn1 Thos. (mark of)
Witness Sn1 TRUDGEN
Witness Fn2 Elizabeth (mark of)
Witness Sn2 STEVENS
Other Information Other Witness: Tobias Read
Transcriber Notes
Transcriber Ian J Trewhella

Baptisms database
Day Month 24-May
Year 1789
Parish Circuit Or Chapel Sithney
Forename Ann
Surname THOMAS
Sex dau
Age Or Date Of Birth
Father Forename
Mother Forename Ann
Residence
Parish
Status Or Occupation
Where Baptised
Notes base
Transcriber Notes
Transcriber D Willey/K Halley

Here is the Parish Register birth entry for Henry ROACH b. 1808 www.familysearch.org/ark:/61903/3:1:S3HY-DHF9-RZ9?i=688&cc=1769414

From Cornwall OPC:
Baptisms database
Day Month 03-Jul
Year 1785
Parish Circuit Or Chapel Towednack
Forename Henry
Surname ROACH
Sex Son
Age Or Date Of Birth
Father Forename Henry
Mother Forename Jane
Residence
Parish
Status Or Occupation
Where Baptised
Notes
Transcriber Notes
Transcriber Hoblyn/R Parsons


And Henry ROACH, his son - maybe Ann Thomas went to St Ives (from Madron) to have the baby
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Henry Roach Or Thomas
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 12 Feb 1808
Baptism Place: Saint Ives,Cornwall,England
Mother: Ann Thomas
FHL Film Number: 0236533, 0236534


OPC Marriages database
Day Month 29-Oct
Year 1831
Parish Circuit Or Chapel Redruth
Groom Fn Henry
Groom Sn ROACH
Groom Age
Groom Residence
Groom Condition Bachelor
Groom Rank Profession
Groom Signed / Marked (S/M)
Groom Father Name
Groom Father Rank Profession
Bride Fn Elizabeth
Bride Sn BRAY
Bride Age
Bride Residence
Bride Condition Spinster
Bride Rank Profession
Bride Signed / Marked (S/M)
Bride Father Name
Bride Father Rank Profession
Banns / Licence (B/L)
Witness Fn1 John
Witness Sn1 BRAY
Witness Fn2 John
Witness Sn2 BRAY
Other Information
Transcriber Notes T H Andrew's Transcripts
Transcriber Kay Woodhouse


In his Will Henry ROACH 1808-1889 states:
'I give to my nephew Henry Roach ROWE of Penzance Cornwall England, the eldest son of my half sister Louisa ROWE (maiden Name WALLIS) [details legacies] and bequeath the following legacies free from legacy duty to my said half sister Louisa ROWE, wife of John ROWE of Cherry Gardens, New Street, Penzance the sum of six hundred pounds and to my servant.....'. This confirms the relationship between Louisa Thomas WALLACE (WALLIS) and Henry ROACH.

Glenys

[genie2]

Henry Roach b.1808 d.1889, Capt of the Burra Burra mine in South Australia - when his cousin Robert ROACH (son of Robert ROACH and Thomasin nee NICHOLLS) m. Elizabeth COUCH in 1801 an Ann THOMAS was a witness.
Marriages database
Day Month 01-May
Year 1801
Parish Circuit Or Chapel Madron
Groom Fn Robert
Groom Sn ROACH
Groom Age
Groom Residence Parish of Ludgvan
Groom Condition
Groom Rank Profession
Groom Signed / Marked (S/M) S
Groom Father Name
Groom Father Rank Profession
Bride Fn Elizabeth
Bride Sn COUCH
Bride Age
Bride Residence otp
Bride Condition
Bride Rank Profession
Bride Signed / Marked (S/M) M
Bride Father Name
Bride Father Rank Profession
Banns / Licence (B/L) Banns
Witness Fn1 Robart
Witness Sn1 ROACH
Witness Fn2 Ann
Witness Sn2 THOMAS XXXXXXXX
Other Information Banns published April 5th, 12th & 19th 1801
Transcriber Notes
Transcriber Ian J Trewhella

And more:
Capt. Robert ROACH, Uncle to Capt. Henry ROACH of Burra Burra Mine: West Briton and Cornwall Advertiser. Friday 6th, June, 1856.
At Tresavean, in the parish of Gwennap, on the 25th ult., Capt. ROBERT ROACH, aged 60 years, for nineteen of which he was an active and faithful agent at Tresavean.

[londoner]

That would make him the Robert Roach baptised at Towenack 22 June 1795, parents Henry and Jane, (opc) and so brother of the Henry mentioned earlier as probable father of Capt Henry (Thomas) Roach

[donne]

Jul 19, 2022 6:17:50 GMT -5 genie2 said:

OPC Baptisms database

And Henry ROACH, his son - maybe Ann Thomas went to St Ives (from Madron) to have the baby
England, Select Births and Christenings, 1538-1975
Name: Henry Roach Or Thomas
Gender: Male
Baptism Date: 12 Feb 1808
Baptism Place: Saint Ives,Cornwall,England
Mother: Ann Thomas
FHL Film Number: 0236533, 0236534

Glenys

Is it possible that the Ann THOMAS in question was a local St. Ives girl? There is nothing in the baptism record for Henry which suggest she was anything other than "of this parish". The ROACH family seems to be based in the adjacent parish of Towednack whereas Madron must be about 8 miles away from St. Ives. Doesn't seem much with modern transport but may be enough to cool the ardour of a suitor when faced with a 16 mile walk there and back!

[Cornish Terrier]

maybe Ann Thomas went to St Ives (from Madron) to have the baby

It was only after Roger's latest post that it occurred to me but Henry Thomas Roach was an illegitimate child and if his single mother was unsupported then it is likely she would have been at the Workhouse for the birth. The Workhouse for the Penzance District was at Madron which would explain the birth/baptism in that Parish so Ann Thomas might well have been a St Ives or even a Towednack or Zennor girl.

CT

[donne]

That's an interesting point about workhouse births but I don't think it applies to the 1808 birth of Henry Roach THOMAS. The Poor Law Unions were set up after 1834 - before that, parish workhouses were much smaller local affairs. From what I read, the Madron workhouse wasn't built until 1838. All the more reason for an unmarried mother to seek the support of family rather than travelling from one parish to another.

[Cornish Terrier]

Yes, you are quite correct ............. and my retention of history is maybe not as good as it should be! I was only reading about the formation of the Penzance Workhouse just a couple of months ago!

And I must have been more confused also as when I added that post I somehow had it in mind that young Henry was baptised at Madron ................ in fact he was baptised at St Ives which makes my post more than a little forgettable.

So, was Ann a local St Ives girl who went to Madron perhaps as a servant sometime after her son was born? Or was it perhaps the other way round - born at Madron/Penzance and employed as a servant at St Ives but returning home after the birth?

No matter which way you look at it the identification of Ann is not getting any easier! Wading through some Thomas Wills might need to be considered in the hope that perhaps Henry was mentioned as a grandson or a nephew.

CT