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Post by tenpoundpom on Nov 20, 2012 6:17:14 GMT -5
So you have more hunting to do yet. Bugger! Hmm..how about John Trewhella? (I did find a post CT made in 2008). Prior to my finding this I had "John" as a number 1 suspect given Ann's father's name, but the only baptism record I could find for a John Trewhella circa 1800 belonged to the well documented son of John Trewhella and Mary Berryman. By now I should have twigged that not all births are recorded in the baptism records. As a sideline I am glad to have discovered Ann and her brood. Who were Ann's parents, and how do they fit into the scheme of things. Andrewwa, Thanks for the clarification on John Berryman. Simon
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 20, 2012 6:36:08 GMT -5
John Trewhella is looking much better. I will leave you to play with that and it will be interesting to see what you can find. Ann Berryman I believe was baptised at St Buryan 3rd May 1793 daughter of John Berryman and Margaret (nee Strick). CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Nov 28, 2012 8:03:55 GMT -5
I've backtracked a little to try and discover some more family connections. Specifically I'm looking a little further into the Pascoe family. My great grandfather, William Henry Trewhella (1865 - 1925) married Kate (Catherine) Edwards Pascoe (1874 - 1938). Kate's parents seem likely to be John Gilbart Pascoe (abt 1844, St Martin) and Frances J Edwards (abt 1846, St Marys, Scilly Isles). Leaving aside the Edwards line for the moment..... John Gilbart Pascoe seems likely to be the son of Joseph Pascoe (abt 1802, Cury) and Catherine Gilbart (abt 1803, St Erth) Things are starting to get more fuzzy... I think Joseph's father is Joseph Pascoe and his mother is Elizabeth Willey with a marriage in Grade, Cornwall 2 April 1799. I have found 9 children baptised between 1800 and 1818 with the parents being listed as Joseph Pascoe (or Jospeh Wills Pascoe) as the father and Elizabeth as the mother. Of note, the first child is James Kempthorne Pascoe (abt 1800), who was baptised at Mullion, which is Joseph's place of residence at the time of the 1799 marriage. Most of the other children are born in Cury, including my likely direct ancestor Joseph Pascoe (1802). Another child is Avis Pascoe (abt 1811 - ) There is an extensive Pascoe family tree on line which covers this family, but does not include some children I've rounded up (notably Avis and Lois -abt 1815). Not sure if I've rounded up a couple of strays who belong to other families! www.airgale.com.au/pascoe/d9.htm#g9is the website and generation I'm referring to! This long winded preamble is part of an attempt to identify the father and mother of Elizabeth Willey. The Pascoe website lists her parents as unknown. I think her parents are likely to be Peter Willey and Avis Boulden, married in Grade, Cornwall 9 July 1776. The grooms residence is Ruan Minor. I am basing this parental suspicion on a baptism record of Elizabeth Willey in Ruan Minor in 1777, daughter of Peter Willey and Avis, and the fact that Elizabeth Pascoe (nee Willey) had a child called Avis Pascoe in 1811. Avis not being a commonly held name I suspect! Any further information on this line will be appreciated, including whether yet again I'm barking up a wrong tree! Simon
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 28, 2012 16:22:56 GMT -5
Simon - I am incapacitated at the moment but will try and get to this late tonight or perhaps tomorrow.
CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 29, 2012 4:18:42 GMT -5
Simon - I had not looked past the marriage of Elizabeth Willey prior to this but now that I have I must say that I concur wholeheartedly with your findings. Also of note is that a Peter Willey, probably Elizabeth's father, was one of the witnesses at her wedding. CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Dec 3, 2012 6:42:03 GMT -5
Also of note is that a Peter Willey, probably Elizabeth's father, was one of the witnesses at her wedding. CT Thanks for that note about the witness. Neither of the sources I had, COPC and FS, had the witnesses documented. It does add weight to this being the correct individuals. The witness may have been her brother (Peter, abt 1781), rather than her father. Anyway, a further step back, has me looking at Peter snr parents being Peter Willey (abt 1716) and Catharine Oliver. Avis/Avice Boulden's parents are possibly Thomas Bolden/Boulden and Mary Rickard/Reckard. Much headaches at this point... So I thought I'd look at some easier connections...and went back to the Edwards line in the Isles of Scilly. A mild headache has turned into a full blown migraine! Frances Jane Edwards (1846) is the daughter of Richard Edwards (1808) and Jane Edwards Sanderson (1810). Jane Edwards Sanderson father is not too hard find. This is Samuel Sanderson (1788 - 1864), a mariner. Her mother is Frances/Fanny (abt 1791). Took some time to track down a marriage (Cornwall OPC and FS had no record that I could find). Not surprisingly, Frances' maiden name was Edwards. So who are Frances Edwards' parents? At this stage I am going with John Edwards and Jane, who have a daughter Frances baptised in 1790 in Scilly. The alternative is William Edwards and Catharine with a Frances baptised in 1793. Samuel Sanderson's father is another Samuel Sanderson, and his mother is Sarah. Again the marriage search took a while to bear fruit, but I think Sarah's maiden name is Phillips. This is as far as I've got so far..a Bex and a good lie down.... seems to be my best option at this point. Might be fun to work out all the family interactions at some stage! CT, if you've looked at this line, I'd be interested to know your findings. If not, and if you are interested, I can provide a bit more detail. Since some Sanderson genes must have trickled through to me I've had a bit of a scout round!
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 3, 2012 8:49:05 GMT -5
Okay Simon - a neat couple of short balls to get me on the back foot! I am going to need a little time to get familiar with this particular Edwards line and then start looking at the IOS records but I should think I might be able to get back onto the front foot and start knocking a few back over your head very shortly. Late tomorrow might be a time when I can sit down and sus out the pitch. CT PS - Seems we have encountered some 'rain delays' in the other match?
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 4, 2012 4:35:41 GMT -5
And I think you should perhaps be considering this one:- Peter son of Oliver and Elizabeth Willy baptised 11th August 1751 Ruan Minor (especially given the first child of Peter and Avis was named Elizabeth ) This one is currently in the OPC records as son of Elizabeth but I have submitted a correction. One other baptism can be found for Oliver and Elizabeth - Oliver baptised 3rd September 1749 at Ruan Minor - but as yet I have not found the marriage. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 4, 2012 6:02:07 GMT -5
William Edwards and Catherine Momford were married at St Mary's, IOS, 12th July 1792 with William Momford and John Edwards as witnesses. They were the parents of Richard Edwards who married Jane Sanderson with Richard and Jane being parents of Frances Jane Edwards. According to the 1851 Cencus Frances Sanderson (nee Edwards) was born on St Mary's about 1790/1 so it is unlikely she was a sister to her future son-in-law Richard. Samuel Sanderson and Frances Edwards were both of St Mary's when they were married at Tresco Church, Tresco, IOS 18th January 1810 but unfortunatelu no witnesses were recorded in the register I have seen. I do suspect that, as you have suggested, Frances was baptised on St Mary's 21st September 1790 daughter of John and Jane Edwards. But it appears the marriage of John and Jane is not going to be all that easy to find. I have checked back to 1778 but it is alwaays possible they married on the mainland. Samuel Sanderson married Sarah Phillips 29th January 1788 at St Mary's, Isles of Scilly with Simon Sanderson and John Phillips as witnesses. All for now. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 4, 2012 6:05:57 GMT -5
There is a marriage for a John Edwards to Jane Johns at St Mary's, IOS 8th August 1765 but that is 25 years before Frances was baptised so may be a little early. I will need to spend some time building up a list of children to see if there may be another family involved.
CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Dec 5, 2012 7:45:08 GMT -5
And I think you should perhaps be considering this one:- Peter son of Oliver and Elizabeth Willy baptised 11th August 1751 Ruan Minor (especially given the first child of Peter and Avis was named Elizabeth ) This one is currently in the OPC records as son of Elizabeth but I have submitted a correction. One other baptism can be found for Oliver and Elizabeth - Oliver baptised 3rd September 1749 at Ruan Minor - but as yet I have not found the marriage. CT Thanks for having a look at this. Oliver & Elizabeth could well be the culprits! The marriage record that I have for Peter & Avis does not have the groom's father name. Whether the Peter who married Avis is the child of Oliver (& Elizabeth), or of Peter (& Catherine) is beyond me at this point. Peter & Oliver are brothers I guess, and if so, I reckon the parents are Peter Willy and Jane Tregidigian. The Edwards/Sanderson Scilly connection is something that I hope to persue further. It would appear that one of the Sandersons went up north to Durham.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 6, 2012 4:35:33 GMT -5
I am a little reluctant to jump to that conclusion as the name Peter Willey seems to have been relatively common around the Lizard Peninsula. If you look at the OPC site and check burials and baptisms for the name 'pet wil' you will find quite a few born within the space of a few years with the name Peter Willey or Peter Willy.
Prior to Civil Registration (commenced July 1837) it is very rare to find the name of a parent mentioned in marriage records.
CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Dec 10, 2012 6:29:29 GMT -5
Samuel Sanderson married Sarah Phillips 29th January 1788 at St Mary's, Isles of Scilly with Simon Sanderson and John Phillips as witnesses. CT I've tried to take this a little further. The way I'm seeing this is that Simon is Samuel's father. Simon had three children with Mary Blewit - Samuel (1765), Mary (1767) and Elizabeth (1770). Samuel marries Sarah Phillips and ends up with me, for better or for worse, a couple of hundred years later. Meanwhile, back in Scilly, Mary must have died and Simon marries Sarah Watts in 1774. Simon and Sarah have one child that I can find - James in 1783. In 1813 James marries Anne Tregarthen. James and Anne have 4 or 5 children - James (1813), James (1814), Annie/Amy (1815), Samuel (1816) and Grace Tregarthen (1818). Not sure about the two James - baptised 6 months apart - maybe, since James (the father) was a mariner and attendance at church would depend upon voyages, the first James was baptised well after the birth and died while his younger namesake was still in the womb. My concerns about my construction relate to the fact that I have Simon Sanderson with two wives - Mary and Sarah. If Mary died then this is easy to explain. I can find no burial for Mary, but I know that it may not have been recorded or that I haven't looked in the right place. Given the size of the population, I think that it is unlikely that there were two Simon Sandersons active in the marriage stakes around the same time. I cannot find a Sanderson on the IOS before Simon. It is not a Cornish sort of name, and he was probably a "blow in", from the North of England - well probably sailed there, given the family maritime occupation! I'd certainly be interested to know if there was any evidence of a Sanderson in the IOS before Simon Sanderson, and whether two different Simon Sandersons were possibly bumping into each other in the 1770s. I realise that I'm straying away from the Trewhella line, but I'm having fun with my sojourn in the IOS. I think there maybe a poignant 1851 Sennen connection with the IOS family ( a shot over the bows in retaliation for the John Trewhella challenge !)
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 10, 2012 8:09:16 GMT -5
Which seems to be somewhat stalled at the moment! Okay - Sandersons for a while. I have been looking through the Scillies PRs which can be a little difficult to follow and I have found somwething of interest. It looks like the clerk got a little lazy at times and recorded the name as SANDERS rather than SANDERSON. Working on that possibility we have the following items to add to your list:- Richard son of Simon and Mary Sanders bp. 3rd January 1772 St Mary's Mary Sanders buried 30th June 1773 William son of Simon and Mary Sanders bp. 2nd March 1777 St Mary's Francis son of Simeon and Sarah Sanders bp. 02nd November 1778 St Mary's Francis son of Simon and Sarah Sanders bp. 5th March 1780 James son of Simon and Sarah Sanderson bp. 8th January 1783 Also interesting is that when he married Sarah Watts the clerk entered Simon's name as SANDERS even though he signed as SANDERSON. Perhaps that supports the notion that the 'Sanders' children also should be 'Sanderson' as I have noted. I have completed the register to the end of 1794 and have just one more to add. You probably have the baptisms of the first two children of Samuel and Sarah Sanderson (Samuel 1788 and Sarah 1789) but perhaps, like his father, you may not have:- Richard son of Samuel and Sarah Sanders bp. 4th November 1791 St Mary's I will try and look at the rest of the scenario tomorrow. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 11, 2012 2:56:40 GMT -5
Before returning to IOS I have found some more bits and pieces of interest to you. Joseph Wills son of James Kempthorne Pascoe was baptised at Mullion 19th June 1776 James Kempthorne Pascoe of Mullion married Mary Hendy of Gunwalloe 1st March 1764 at Gunwalloe. Witnesses were John Wills and John Pearce CT
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