The family of John Trewhella and Jane Chinn

[ljmckinnon]

Searching the web for my Cornish ancestors, I noticed that someone on this board had some information on my GGG Grandparents John Trewhella (1811-1883) and Jane Chinn. I had not previously known their place of residence, nor John's date of death, and am hoping that the experts here may be able to clear up some other mysteries relating to this family.

His son Matthew Trewhella apparently emmigrated to Australia at a young age (his death certificate indicates he was around 10 years old - c. 1862), and according to family lore was accompanied by a Christopher Trewhella (his brother?), but I have never found any primary records for this. Does anyone here know anything further about John and Jane's children and the circumstances in which Matthew came to Australia? Also, has any research been done into Jane Chinn's background, about which I have also drawn a blank?

Regards,

Leigh

[myghaelangof]

Welcome to the forum Leigh.
I'm sure Cornish Terrier, aka Ian Trewhella, will have plenty to say on this over the next few days.

[Mal]

I have Trewheela in my lines, but further back, your best bet is, as An Gof says, Mr Trewhella of Australia.... could be a strong connection there.

[Cornish Terrier]

G'day Leigh - welcome to our little gathering.

I will be very interested to learn exactly where you fit into the family as it would appear from your introductory note that we share the same ancestors - William TREWHELLA married Ann COCK at Towednack 31st December 1767.

First thing I can is that I have no idea exactly when, or under what circumstances, Matthew TREWHELLA came to Victoria.

I have just spent a couple of hours looking at information about the family and re-checking Passenger Lists etc. and can still find no record of him.

I will try to keep this note brief but will be able to add much more in the coming days as our discussions progress. (And after I have had some rest.)

John TREWHELLA married Jane CHINN at the Wesleyan Chapel, Hayle on 5th January 1850. (I only recently found that information via the West Briton Online.)

They had four children who must have all been baptised in the Chapels or on the Wesleyan Circuit or similar.
It seems that wherever they were baptised the Registers were not available at the Cornwall Record Office when I was there in 1994.

However:-
John born 1850 Phillack died 16th February 1900 at Phillack and was buried 20th February 1900.
He married Jane Pryor BOWDEN at Phillack 5th November 1872.

Jane was 11 years older than John and had been previously married. I know of no children to John TREWHELLA.

Matthew born 1852 and you seem to know a fair bit about him which we can discuss further later on.

Martha Jane born 1854 at Phillack married John BENNETT at Phillack i n 1877 but I know nothing more about her just yet.

Catherine born 1855 at Phillack.

I have just re-checked the Census records and Matthew has gone by 1871 which fits with the details on his Death Certificate of which I also have a copy.

You will have noticed, no doubt, that his parents were named as Matthew TREWHELLA and Margaret (formerly JANE) which is very obviously incorrect.

As for travelling to Australia with a Christopher TREWHELLA ....

He did have an uncle Christopher but I have no record of him ever having left Cornwall and I would be wondering why he should bring a young nephew to Australia and then return without him.

There was another Christopher TREWHELLA who came out to Victoria and also settled in Bendigo.
This fellow would have been a cousin but he was married at Bendigo in 1860 so was here a good while before Matthew's alleged arrival. In fact it appears that Christopher arrived in 1858 according to my records.

I must say that I had never heard the story about Matthew arriving with a Christopher but ...

Given you did not seem to know of any siblings I think you will now be interested in his sister Catherine.

Catherine married James STEPHENS at St John's Church, Latrobe St., MELBOURNE in 1889 and died in Brunswick in 1921.

At the moment I only have one son recorded for her and he was born in 1896 so I must do some more work there.

Whilst searching the PROV Passenger Index earlier I think I have found Catherine's arrival.

In the 1871 and 1881 Census she was known as 'Cate' and there was a 'Kate' TREWHELLA, age 28, arriving in Victoria in November 1884 on the "Orient".

Right name and right age and I am sure this is her.

Now - I had never really tried to research the CHINN side of the family. Primarily, I think, because I did not have access to the required records at the time.

But I have tonight had a search around and I 'think' I have got Jane's family.

One problem with Jane is that she never seemed to know just how old she was.

In the 1841 Census she was 6.
In the 1851 Census she was 22.
In the 1861 Census she was 29.
In the 1871 Census she was 30. (This could be 38 but looks more like 30)
In the 1881 Census she was 48.

I cannot find her in 1891 at the moment but when she died in 1896 her age was recorded as 63.

From what I have found tonight it looks like she was the daughter of John and Martha CHINN.

The Transcript of the Parish Register for Phillack shows JOHN baptised 4th May 1834 at Phillack but the IGI records this as JANE.

I have since found John's baptism in 1832 at Gwithian.

So, as I currently understand it, the family is this:-

John CHINN married Martha OLIVER at Phillack 5th February 1826

In the Census Martha's birthplace is given as Gorran so she would be:-

Marth OLIVER bp. 25th April 1802 at Gorran d/o Charles & Catherine

I have not yet tried to locate John CHINN's baptism as there are more than one of that name in the area so will need to check it carefully.

Children for John and Martha are:-

William bp. 17th October 1826 at Phillack
Catherine bp. 15th June 1828 at Phillack
John bp. 22nd April 1832 at Gwithian
Jane bp. 4th May 1834 at Phillack
Edward bp. 22nd November 1835 at Phillack
Joanna bp. 29th December 1839 at Phillack
Martha J born about 1843 at Phillack

That is about all I can tell you about them at the moment.

And I am not 100% certain this is the right family but it certainly looks like it might be.

I had best finish up now and get away from the PC for a while I think.

Look forward to further discussion with you and let's see if we can find out a little more about Matthew and his arrival in Australia.

CT

[ljmckinnon]

Thanks a lot for that.
I finally found some papers on the family's history that I didn't have to hand when I did my first post, and realize that I was mistaken about talk of Christopher coming out with Matthew (which was a chronological impossibility anyway) - so my apologies for introducing that red hearing! I was in contact with one of Christopher's WA descendants about 8 years ago - Terry Siefken - and he faxed me some handwritten notes on the family's history which, much to my surprise, contained a section on Matthew Trewhella which was based in part on an interview with his daughter Myrtle Penna (1904-1988) whom I remember visiting as a child with my mother and grandma (her niece). I am not certain if Siefken's information came from any of your earlier researches - I understand that you spoke to Myrtle, or at least her daughter Shirley Christie, a number of years ago. There is mention there too of Matthew's sister "Kate who married a man by the name of Stevens" (sic).

As to Matthew's arrival in Australia I have not found any certain evidence of his presence in Victoria before his marriage at Long Gully, Bendigo on Christmas Day, 1882. Interestingly his wife Annie Hocking Thomas also came out to Australia at a young age as a companion to her mother's sister Mrs Emma Nankervis, in whose house Annie and Matthew were married. I wonder if any of Matthew's extended family similarly took the young man (or boy, if his death certificate is to be believed) with them out to the colonies? And if he didn't arrive in Victoria, perhaps the South Australian records would be worth checking?

Anyway, that's all I've got for the moment (not much, I know), and thank you again for your help.

Leigh

[Cornish Terrier]

Tnanks Leigh - every little bit helps!

Yes I did speak with Myrtle and Shirley many years ago - back in the 1980's I would think - and I have some correspondence from them here somewhere.

What is interesting about Matthew and Christopher is that they both ended up in (or around) Bendigo.

My family was at Blackwood and then Trentham (hence Trewhella Brothers).

And I remember talking to many descendants of Christopher amongst whom at least one claimed that his grandfather (I think) made mention of them being cousins to my family at Trentham.

I now have enough evidence to suggest that link is probable although I am missing one vital item - the baptism of Christopher's father John.

I do know that John settled at Sennen but the Census records show that he was born at Towednack about 1800.

That comgined with the names of his children suggest only one family to which he could belong and that is the family of William TREWHELLA who married Ann GLASSON at Lelant in 1797 - my 4xgt-grandparents.

This William was the son of William and Ann (nee COCK) TREWHELLA who are also your own ancestors.

There is another parallel between Christopher and Matthew - children of each also went to Western Australia and specifically to the Boulder/Kalgoorlie area.

Thanks also for the little bit of added information about Annie THOMAS which I will follow up shortly.

I am interested in sharing further information with you and would like to fill in some of the gaps I have in later generations that I have neglected since turning to the 'dark ages' for information on earlier ancestors.

We can utilise PM (private message available here) or email for some of this.

CT

[Cornish Terrier]

Leigh - have just found some information on the THOMAS family that you may not have.

Nicholas Hocking THOMAS married Mary Ann HARVEY 14th August 1861 at Pendeen

Nicholas was buried at Pendeen 12th May 1894 age 55 of Boscaswell

Mary Ann buried at Pendeen 30th September 1887 age 47 of Boatmans Row

I cannot find Annie in the 1871 Census so she had possibly already left Cornwall.

Children of Nicholas and Mary Ann THOMAS:-

Mary Ann bp. 9th July 1862 Pendeen ***
John Hosking bp. 31st July 1863 Pendeen
Elizabeth bp. 28th April 1867 Pendeen
Nicholas Hocken bp. 25th February 1874 Pendeen
Mary Jane Grenfell bp. 18th March 1877 Pendeen (bu. 21st March 1877)

Those are as the names appear in the Transcript of the Pendeen Parish Register.

*** This will be Annie Hocking so may be she altered her name to distinguish herself from her mother.

Her mother:-

Mary Ann Williams HARVEY bp. 29th December 1841 at St Just in Penwith daughter of Francis and Alice HARVEY of Trewellard.

Francis HARVEY, widr. age 37, son of Francis HARVEY married Alice WILLIAMS, spinster, age 23, daughter of John WILLIAMS 2nd November 1840 at St Just in Penwith

Will try and find a first marriage for Francis and then will try and find some details about Nicholas.

Will see what more I can find.

CT

[Cornish Terrier]

Leigh - I now have the HARVEY line back to a marriage at St Just in Penwith in 1795.

Also have the THOMAS line back to a marriage at St Just in 1804.

I am pretty much confident of all the links back to both marriages.

Although I cannot find a baptism for Emma HARVEY (could have been baptised in one of the Chapels) I did find her marriage to Henry NANKERVIS.

Henry NANKERVIS age 21 of Trewellard, miner, son of Thomas NANKERVIS married Emily HARVEY age 19 of Trewellard daughter of Francis HARVEY 30th June 1866 at Pendeen

Also found her death in the Victorian Federation Index in 1891 but cannot find Henry.

Do you have the details of when she arrived in Victoria with her young niece??

Next thing is to probably have another search to see if some record of Matthew TREWHELLA can be found - either leaving the UK or arriving in Australia.

Cheers,

CT

[ljmckinnon]

Annie THOMAS arrived in Victoria on the "Durham" in September 1879, her age is given as 16. Also aboard were:

Henry NANKERVIS 33
Emma " " 31
Henry 8
Thomas 6
Francis H 4
William J 1

The youngest child William John Nankervis was one of the witnesses, along with his wife Florence Mabel, on the marriage certificate of my G Grandparents - Jane Trewhella (1883-1962) and William Schlemme (1882-1936) - in 1907, so a close relationship existed between the two families for several decades after their arrival in Australia.

Also, I think that the ancestry of Annie Thomas, particularly through the line of her paternal grandmother Clarinda Cornish Wallis, has been fairly well researched by other distant family members similar to the efforts of Kathy Weigel and yourself with the Trewhellas (although I'm not sure if it's all still online). But my own particular branch hasn't been so well researched so the information that your finding really does help to fill out the picture.

Regards,

Leigh

[Mal]

Too much info to process for me but does this line go back to the Trewheela's connected to my Vingoe branch?

[Cornish Terrier]

Leigh - that's good stuff, thank you.

Now - two things.

One - I know you require more info on the CHINN line so I will work on that. But can you tell me what other information you are looking for so that I might help there also?

Two - Seems there will be quite a bit that I would like from you if I may.
First would be the details of marriage for Jane TREWHELLA and William SCHLEMME - date, place, witnesses etc.
I know basically nothing about William SCHLEMME but I understand that Jane married a second time to someone named DUNN so I would like some details there if you have them.

I only have birth dates for three children of Matthew and Annie TREWHELLA - Hedley John, Samuel Nicholas and Myrtle Annie so if you have anything else there it would be appreciated.

Also, the children of William and Jane SCHLEMME where you obviously ultimately fit in - I only know that there was Elsa Dulcie born 1907, Edna May born 1908, William Matthew born 1910 and died 1966 and Robert - that is all the information I have there.

AH - Have just found Jane's marriage to Henry DUNN in 1926.

As I said in a previous note - we can do a lot of this via PM or email.

Malcolm - The connection to Sarah VINGOE is there.

Sarah VINGOE married William BLIGHT at Ludgvan 9th May 1803

Of their nine children there are two daughters with TREWHELLA connections.

Sarah bp. 3rd November 1816 at Ludgvan married Martin TREWHELLA 12th August 1838 at Ludgvan.

Johanna bp. 14th April 1822 at Ludgvan married James JENKIN in 1842

Johanna Blight JENKIN d/o James and Johanna married John TREWHELLA son of Martin and Sarah (first cousins) in the USA.

What I have yet to establish are the parents and predecessors of Sarah VINGOE so I might just take a look at that now.

Where you, Leigh and I connect here on the TREWHELLA line is with the marriage of William TREWHELLA to Ann COCK at Towednack 31st December 1767.

William s/o William and Ann (nee COCK) married Ann GLASSON at Lelant 10th June 1797

They are my direct ancestors and also the parents of Martin who married Sarah BLIGHT.

Matthew s/o William and Ann (nee COCK) married Martha DANIELL at Towednack 2nd August 1801 and their son John married Jane CHINN at Hayle in 1850 - this is Leigh's connection.

Hope that makes sense!

Right - off to check some Vingoes!

[Cornish Terrier]

Well Guess What I cannot find anything that will help me identify Sarah VINGOE.

All I can find is that she was still alive in 1851 and she appears to have died in 1857.

In the 1851 Census she was living with her daughter-in-law Phillis (wife of son James BLIGHT) and her children - James was obviously elsewhere as he is at home in 1861.

The birthplace for everyone in that particular household in 1851 is recorded as - CORNWALL

The only other thing I now know is that Sarah was age 72 in 1851 and, therefore, born about 1778/9 in all probability.

The only Sarah VINGOEs I can find near that age (and there aren't many in total) are both at Sennen - one bp. 1777 and the other 1782.

But it is probable that both of these were involved in a couple of the marriages recorded at Sennen a little later.

The only other 'possible' clue I have is from the names of the BLIGHT children.

William obviously named after his father (who was deceased by 1841).
Peter named after William's father.
JAMES - does not appear in the family of William BLIGHT so 'may' be the name of Sarah VINGOE's father.

But a search on IGI for marriages for James VINGOE and we get only Sennen around the right time and one of those was the father of Sarah baptised in 1782.

Looks like we need to try and track down some Wills I think!

The CRO Online Catalogue shows only two entries for VINGO and 37 under VINGOE.

Of these we have only two that would appear to be of possible interest.

ARD/158 Christian Edwards, spinster, of Lelant versus William VINGOE, yeoman, of Ludgvan - Defamation Case

ARD/160/315 - 31st July 1801 William VINGOE of Ludgvan excommunicated for Defamation

The marriage of Sarah to William BLIGHT is the only VINGOE marriage at Ludgvan and there is only one baptism - that of a bastard child to Jane VINGO in 1804.

That's it folks!

[londoner]

According to George & Sandra Pritchard's Vingoe Family Website:
Sarah VINGOE b: June 23, 1782 : Sennen Cornwall. d. 11th Nov 1857, @ Tregender, Ludgvan

................................................. + William BLIGHT b. 22nd Jan. 1775, d. 8th Feb 1840, Crowlas
The will of her brother William is also quoted.
and the intro to the site has much of the stuff about Treville/Arundell that Malcolm mentioned in his other thread

[Cornish Terrier]

Thank you Londoner - nice to have you back.

Best I go have a look at the VINGOE site for myself I think.

[Cornish Terrier]

Malcolm - go have a look at the Vingoe Family Tree, you will find it most interesting.

Just type in "Vingoe" as a Google Search and it should nearly come up at the top of the list.

I found it a little difficult to navigate around but got where I wanted in the end.

Be aware that there are errors in there also which I probably should document and send to George and Sandra for amendment.

Let me know if you have any trouble with it and I will try and guide you through.

CT