Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 12, 2007 13:27:36 GMT -5
Bruce - thanks for that information.
As I believe I mentioned the name 'Baron' came from a Transcript of the PR which was done by (I forget who) someone who was professional enough to acknowledge that 'mistakes can be made' and that original records should be checked.
I am in need of sleep so will have to leave this for now but will get back to it in the coming days.
I have found the source of the name Aaron: he is named after his maternal uncle [ mother's brother] Aaron Martin , born St Keverne 1805. Now how AM got his name is yet to be determined. Bruce Mudgee NSW
Post by anneyoungau on Nov 12, 2010 5:05:39 GMT -5
I am new to this forum and am interested in catching up on research into the Gilbart / Gilbert family of St Erth and nearby.
My husband's 3*great grandmother was Mary Gilbart (1805-1867). She married Thomas Edwards and they emigrated with their children to Victoria, Australia in 1849. They were following Mary's sister Sarah who had married Francis Tuckfield who was a missionary in Victoria.
Mary and Sarah's parents were John and Elizabeth (maiden surname Huthnance). John was born about 1860. I believe he was an agent of the Copper Company. I believe he died in 1837. I am not sure of his parents - I think I have found a christening where he is the son of James and Catherine. I have also found a mention of a will which perhaps is linked - James Gilbart, Phillack written - 04-Aug 1794 proved - 13-May 1795 pages - 436 wife - Catherine son - John mentions - Mr Nicholas Trengrous witnesses - ? from freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~sterth/wills1793_97.htm
Any advice or pointers to useful sources gratefully received
Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 15, 2010 4:50:22 GMT -5
Hi Anne - now that I have been able to check my own information I have a couple of answers for you.
I believe you are correct with the baptism and parents of John Gilbart.
John son of James and Catherine GILBERT baptised 31st March 1760 at Phillack
John and Elizabeth seem to have followed a naming pattern. The first two children were named John and Elizabeth and then came James and Catherine which we will take, for the moment, as being after John's parents.
That being the case then the next few children (Mary, Francis, Sarah etc.) should hopefully give us the names of the parents of Elizabeth Huthnance.
UNLESS - Elizabeth's parents were also named John and Elizabeth!
From IGI the only candidate seems to be:-
Elizabeth daughter of John and Elizabeth Huthnance bp. 8th August 1774 at Gwinear
That baptism is an almost perfect match for the burial of an Elizabeth Gilbart who was buried at St Erth 5th July 1847 age 73.
I believe this is probably John's wife although I have found some discrepancies in information.
John Gilbart was buried at St Erth 10th February 1837 and the OPC transcribed record shows that he was age 76.
However! - this event can also be found in the transcriptions from the West Briton dated Friday 10th February 1837.
John is described as having died 'on Sunday last' (5th) and that he was one of the proprietors of the Iron Battery Mills. He is also described as age 78.
In 1841 Elizabeth Gilbart was living at Battery Mill, St Erth along with children John, Thomazine, Margery, William, Thomas and Jane. Also in the household is Elizabeth Edwards, age 9, who I currently presume to have been her grandaughter.
Elizabeth's age was 65 which puts her birth probably sometime between 1771 and 1776.
(You won't find this Census record on Ancestry! But you will find it in the Cornwall Online Census Project transcription.
Now let's have another look at the burial:-
Elizabeth Gilbart buried at St Erth 5th July 1847 age 73
The West Briton has the following entry in its edition of Friday 16th July 1847:-
At St Erth, on the 8th inst., Elizabeth, wife of Capt. John Gilbert, of St Erth, Ba.... Mills, aged 25? years
The age is obviously difficult to read, hence the ?, so it could be 75. BUT - the record states that the death occurred on the 8th inst., which is 3 days after the above burial!
FreeBMD shows only one death recorded for an Elizabeth Gilbert/Gilbart in the September Qtr of 1847 in the Penzance R.D.
And the transcription of St Erth burials also shows only one Elizabeth buried in that time period which leads to the conclusion that the above burial and the entry from the West Briton must be for the same person.
Question - which of the two is in error?
BTW - James Gilbert married Catherine Pearce 16th April 1752 at Gwinear
For what it's worth, I had a look at the images of the St Erth burials today. I found Elizabeth GILBART of St Erth buried 5 July 1847, age 73 (the 3 is hard to read unless you blow the image up, and then it is quite clear). Rev T Pascoe, vicar of St Hilary, officiated at the burial.
Re Francis Gilbart b 1807 (Miller and flour factor) and the elusive servant widow Elizabeth and children who was living with him in the 1851 Census a @ #2 Trewinnar Mill, St. Erth.
The 1851 census says she is servant widow and housekeeper. Listed under her are Sarah Ann looks like she is listed as a dau in law, with ditto for John, Elizabeth and Mary Ann. Most curious. In the US an in-law would mean they were the children of his wife by another marriage.
I see in the 1861 census that Francis is 54 a provisions factor. Living with him was wife Eliz 54, Sarah Ann 21 dau and shop assistant, John 20, Eliz 17 dau and shop assistant and Mary Ann 15 dau. Would say that Francis married a brother's wife.
Living in the next property in the 1851 census at Battery Mill was William Gilbart. Wild guess is that they are related. I like the idea that Francis had an alternative name.
In the 1841 census there were 2 families living in Battery Mill : Elizabeth Gilbart 65, John Gilbart 40, Thomarine 30, Margerey Gilbart 25, William Gilbart 25, Thomas Gilbart 25, Jane Gilbart 20, Elizabeth Edwards, Elizabeth Davey 15. Also living at Batterymills was a second family of James Gilbart 40 Iron Factory, Ann Gilbart 50, Ann Gilbart 14, Maria Gilbart 10 and Ann Pellow 40.
I know my cousins are related to Thomas Trewhella Gilbart. I suspect he was son of Thomas (1816 -) and Jane (1822-), who could be the son of John (1760-1837) and Elizabeth Huthnance (1774-1847).
Post by Cornish Terrier on Jul 8, 2011 9:26:32 GMT -5
Hi Chris and Welcome.
I have not looked at the early part of your note for some time but it would appear that I will have to do so very shortly!
But I can confirm that you are correct regarding the links for Thomas Trewhella Gilbart. The 'Trewhella' comes from his mother's side of the family - she being Jane Rogers who was baptised at St Erth 26th May 1822 daughter of James Rogers and Jane Trewheela who were married at St Erth 16th September 1820.
Super, I had initially guessed that Jane was a Rogers, then in the absence of "fact", called her Jane Gilbart(). Seemed sort of natural that a farmers wife with a missing husband, and a male with the right name and age living in the family of Rogers... However, Jane Rogers should be a relatively common name.
I saw that Trewhella was a local family name but could not make the connection, Thanks !
Post by Cornish Terrier on Jul 9, 2011 3:42:40 GMT -5
And now for the initial part of your post.
Francis Gilbart was an elder brother of Thomas and was therefore an uncle to Thomas Trewhella Gilbart. I don't think Francis had any children of his own but, as per the Census, he did marry.
As far as I am aware Francis was the sixth of 13 children to John Gilbart and Elizabeth Huthnance with Thomas being the 12th child and youngest son.
Second child and eldest son was John who was born in 1800. And this is where that Census record will be made clear.
John Gilbart married Elizabeth Wearn about 1831 or 1832 although I am yet to find the marriage.
There were seven children from this marriage before John died at Little Mill, St Erth 24th September 1847. He was buried at St Erth three days later on the 27th September age 45.
From memory John's brother Francis was with his widowed sister-in-law and her children in 1851 although without looking at the Census again I cannot remember if Francis was Elizabeth or if Elizabeth and the children were with Francis.
However, in the March Qtr of 1852, possibly at the Registry Office, Francis and his widowed sister-in-law were married and hence the interesting mix of information from the 1851 and 1861 Census.