Tracing great grandparents

[grose]

Hello
I am trying to trace my great grandfathers roots. He was born in Penzance Cornwall around 1869. Name Ernest Grose and from Cornwall. Married Annie Jane Trewlla Uren In Penzance before emigrating to South Africa. Any info or guidance would be appreciated.
Regards
Tracy

[Cornish Terrier]

Hi Trace and Welcome to Penwith Genealogy.

Ernest Grose was born in the March Qtr of 1869 at Penzance and baptised privately at Penzance St Mary 11th March 1870 son of Nicholas Grose, a hatter, and Elizabeth Penaluna Grose nee Eddy who were married at Gulval 24th July 1842. He was the youngest of 11 children.

Annie Jane Trewhella Uren was born 14th February 1870 at Ludgvan and baptised 25th February 1872 at Towednack, Cornwall, daughter of William Uren and Kitty Trewhella who married 7th July 1869 at Lelant.

I am not yet sure what happened but it appears William and Kitty Uren must have separated somewhere around the time their third child, Katie, was born. She was baptised 8th March 1879 at Gulval.

But it appears that William also had an illegitimate daughter, Edith Uren Matthews, who was born at Madron 8th February 1879 and baptised 2nd October 1879!!

I still don't know what happened to William Uren but Kitty (nee Trewhella) came out to Australia. She died at Glen Innes, NSW 9th February 1912.

CT

[grose]

Aug 21, 2022 21:42:38 GMT -5 Cornish Terrier said:

Hi Trace and Welcome to Penwith Genealogy.

Ernest Grose was born in the March Qtr of 1869 at Penzance and baptised privately at Penzance St Mary 11th March 1870 son of Nicholas Grose, a hatter, and Elizabeth Penaluna Grose nee Eddy who were married at Gulval 24th July 1842. He was the youngest of 11 children.

Annie Jane Trewhella Uren was born 14th February 1870 at Ludgvan and baptised 25th February 1872 at Towednack, Cornwall, daughter of William Uren and Kitty Trewhella who married 7th July 1869 at Lelant.

I am not yet sure what happened but it appears William and Kitty Uren must have separated somewhere around the time their third child, Katie, was born. She was baptised 8th March 1879 at Gulval.

But it appears that William also had an illegitimate daughter, Edith Uren Matthews, who was born at Madron 8th February 1879 and baptised 2nd October 1879!!

I still don't know what happened to William Uren but Kitty (nee Trewhella) came out to Australia. She died at Glen Innes, NSW 9th February 1912.

CT

[grose]

Thank you very much for the info. Is there any record of Ernest emigrating to South Africa where he a and Annie Jane had my grandfather Ernest Penn and others. And are any of Ernest’s siblings still in Cornwall to contact as I am in the UK.
Thanks 😊

[donne]

There are lots of interesting records naming Ernest Grose on the FamilySearch website - just put Ernest Grose and South Africa in the search boxes, though you may have to create a free account if you don't already have one. I can't find any immigration records but presumably this preceded the earliest South African Grose birth which appears in the record, which is William Ernest Grose born 16 Oct 1896 to parents Ernest and Annie Grose in Johannesburg. Unfortunately William Ernest didn't survive long and his death is recorded on 20 Oct 1899 in Pietermaritzburg - the father's occupation is recorded as 'miner' by the way. In case you haven't found it, your grandfather's birth, Ernest Penn Grose, was recorded as 25 Jan 1903. Ernest himself died 8 Jun 1921, survived by spouse Annie Jane Trewhalla Grose (born Uren) and three children Lionel, Elizabeth Audrey and Ernest Penn.

[Cornish Terrier]

Donne - actually there were two sons named William Ernest Grose as I have just discovered.

1. William Ernest son of Ernest and Annie born 16th October 1896 at Johannesburg and baptised 22nd March 1897 Johannesburg St Mary. He died 1st April 1897 at Frederick Street Johannesburg age 5-1/2 months.
2. William Ernest Grose age 6-1/2 months child of E. Grose, miner, died 20th October 1899 121 Greyling Street Pietermaritzburg. (I have not been able to find a birth/baptism for him as yet)

Ernest Grose was the youngest of 13 children of whom two (Mary 1848-1849 and Olive Penaluna 1864-1866) died young. It is possible some of them may have descendents still living in the UK but I have not tried to trace them.

CT

[grose]

Aug 22, 2022 21:55:30 GMT -5 Cornish Terrier said:

Donne - actually there were two sons named William Ernest Grose as I have just discovered.

1. William Ernest son of Ernest and Annie born 16th October 1896 at Johannesburg and baptised 22nd March 1897 Johannesburg St Mary. He died 1st April 1897 at Frederick Street Johannesburg age 5-1/2 months.
2. William Ernest Grose age 6-1/2 months child of E. Grose, miner, died 20th October 1899 121 Greyling Street Pietermaritzburg. (I have not been able to find a birth/baptism for him as yet)

Ernest Grose was the youngest of 13 children of whom two (Mary 1848-1849 and Olive Penaluna 1864-1866) died young. It is possible some of them may have descendents still living in the UK but I have not tried to trace them.

CT

[grose]

Aug 23, 2022 5:03:21 GMT -5 grose said:

Aug 22, 2022 21:55:30 GMT -5 Cornish Terrier said:

Donne - actually there were two sons named William Ernest Grose as I have just discovered.

1. William Ernest son of Ernest and Annie born 16th October 1896 at Johannesburg and baptised 22nd March 1897 Johannesburg St Mary. He died 1st April 1897 at Frederick Street Johannesburg age 5-1/2 months.
2. William Ernest Grose age 6-1/2 months child of E. Grose, miner, died 20th October 1899 121 Greyling Street Pietermaritzburg. (I have not been able to find a birth/baptism for him as yet)

Ernest Grose was the youngest of 13 children of whom two (Mary 1848-1849 and Olive Penaluna 1864-1866) died young. It is possible some of them may have descendents still living in the UK but I have not tried to trace them.

CT

[grose]

Aug 23, 2022 5:03:33 GMT -5 grose said:

Aug 23, 2022 5:03:21 GMT -5 grose said:

Thank you so much again for this info
Are you finding it on family search?
Regards
Tracy

[Cornish Terrier]

Thank you so much again for this info
Are you finding it on family search?

Yes, most of this has been found on FamilySearch. And, where available, you can also view images of the documents.

CT

[grose]

Great thanks 😊

[spikeharwood]

Hi Tracy,
I check my new DNA matches on My Heritage every morning. Today I have a match with you! I recognised Trewlla Uren in your ancestral surnames list.
The match appears to be maternal, otherwise you'd be matching my father and possibly his brother or my paternal cousins. You don't match my sister though.
It's a decent size match of 30.8cM, over 3 segments the largest being 16.8cM.
My mother had seven Cornish great grandparents, the eighth was Scottish - Robert McIntosh. He is shown in the 1861 census in Cornwall as a visitor. In 1864 he married into my Cornish Davey line.
He was b 1841 in Fife and I believe his parents were William McIntosh and Janet Wilson but I've not found a marriage or baptisms for them.
I've been following this thread and none of your Cornish surnames are prominent in any of my lines. So I'm inclined to think the match is on your Scottish side of the family.

I'll have a look at the 13 people on MH that we have triangulated segments with and I'll check out my spreadsheet that records names against segments and see what I come up with.

S

[grose]

Aug 26, 2022 17:52:00 GMT -5 spikeharwood said:

Hi Tracy,
I check my new DNA matches on My Heritage every morning. Today I have a match with you! I recognised Trewlla Uren in your ancestral surnames list.
The match appears to be maternal, otherwise you'd be matching my father and possibly his brother or my paternal cousins. You don't match my sister though.
It's a decent size match of 30.8cM, over 3 segments the largest being 16.8cM.
My mother had seven Cornish great grandparents, the eighth was Scottish - Robert McIntosh. He is shown in the 1861 census in Cornwall as a visitor. In 1864 he married into my Cornish Davey line.
He was b 1841 in Fife and I believe his parents were William McIntosh and Janet Wilson but I've not found a marriage or baptisms for them.
I've been following this thread and none of your Cornish surnames are prominent in any of my lines. So I'm inclined to think the match is on your Scottish side of the family.

I'll have a look at the 13 people on MH that we have triangulated segments with and I'll check out my spreadsheet that records names against segments and see what I come up with.

S

[grose]

Aug 31, 2022 7:44:05 GMT -5 grose said:

Aug 26, 2022 17:52:00 GMT -5 spikeharwood said:

Hi Tracy,
I check my new DNA matches on My Heritage every morning. Today I have a match with you! I recognised Trewlla Uren in your ancestral surnames list.
The match appears to be maternal, otherwise you'd be matching my father and possibly his brother or my paternal cousins. You don't match my sister though.
It's a decent size match of 30.8cM, over 3 segments the largest being 16.8cM.
My mother had seven Cornish great grandparents, the eighth was Scottish - Robert McIntosh. He is shown in the 1861 census in Cornwall as a visitor. In 1864 he married into my Cornish Davey line.
He was b 1841 in Fife and I believe his parents were William McIntosh and Janet Wilson but I've not found a marriage or baptisms for them.
I've been following this thread and none of your Cornish surnames are prominent in any of my lines. So I'm inclined to think the match is on your Scottish side of the family.

I'll have a look at the 13 people on MH that we have triangulated segments with and I'll check out my spreadsheet that records names against segments and see what I come up with.

S

[grose]

Hi
Annie Jane Trewalla Urin was married to my great grandfather Ernest Grose and they emigrated to South Africa
My other great grandfather was Alfred Godfrey McDonald and on my grandmothers birth certificate he says he’s from Scotland. But no other info 🤷‍♀️