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Post by Deleted on Apr 27, 2015 4:22:52 GMT -5
CT et al
I would like to introduce the marriage of 11th September 1810 at Gwennap between Joseph Glasson of Crowan and Sophia Teague, bachelor and spinster. Perhaps of some relevance in the discussion to come is that one of the witnesses is a Francis Pool.
BDM records are sparse for this couple after 1810, however there is a baptism at Redruth St Uny on 20th January 1824 for Caroline Glasson, daughter of Joseph and Sophia.
There is a burial at Redruth St Uny on the 26th March 1827 for a seven year old Sophia which I am assuming is another daughter.
The family does not appear in the 1841 census of England.
However this family arrived at New York aboard the "Clio" on the 1st May 1832. Joseph Glasson, aged 45, carpenter, born Cornwall. Sophia Glasson, aged 45, born Cornwall Elizabeth aged 21, Rosanna aged 16, Henry aged 14, and Caroline aged 8 - all born in Cornwall. This is clearly the same family as can be seen by Caroline's birth year.
This information suggests that Joseph is the son of a John and Elizabeth Glasson, baptised 6/1/1788 at Gwinear. Sophia is the daughter of John and Mary, baptised 24/6/1784 at Redruth.
So who is this Joseph. I do not think that anybody has him placed in a family before now.
Lannanta
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Apr 27, 2015 6:07:56 GMT -5
A puzzle indeed!
The entry in the Gwinear Parish Register clearly shows that Joseph son of John and Elizabeth Glasson was baptized 6th January 1788 at Gwinear. So, provided the Vicar has not made an error in filling out the register, there appear to be just two marriages close enough to have any bearing.
1. John Glazant, yeoman, and Elizabeth Rodda, widow 18th June 1773 Crowan 2. John Glasson and Elizabeth Bottrall 3rd February 1788 Camborne
Perhaps a third might be considered briefly:- 3. John Glasson, widower, miller, and Elizabeth Rowling, spinster 24th April 1779 Paul
The earliest baptism I can find that might connect with any of these three marriages is not until 29th February 1780 at Camborne when Elizabeth daughter of John and Elizabeth Glasson is privately baptized. The next baptism to John and Elizabeth is that of Joseph at Gwinear in 1788 and it should be noted that Joseph was baptized ONE MONTH BEFORE the marriage to Elizabeth Botttrall. That would then suggest that Joseph's mother was either the widowed Elizabeth Rodda at Crowan or Elizabeth Rowling at Paul.
I am unable to find baptisms for any of the other children of Joseph and Sophia.
Perhaps your knowledge of the Camborne families might help you sort out the relevance of some of the above.
The only other items of possible interest I can find for Joseph Glasson are two marriages at Crowan in 1809 and 1810 at which he appears to have been a witness - 1. 28th October 1809 Charles Tonkin and Hannah Pearce and 2. 29th September 1810 Richard Eustis and Sarah Noble.
CT
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Post by Deleted on May 1, 2015 23:04:50 GMT -5
CT
This problem shows how difficult it is to place the earlier Glassons in their respective families with so many unknown John/William Glassons yet to be accounted for.
Researching Joseph a little more I have found that his other children were born in London where he worked as a carpenter/cabinet maker before emigrating. Sophia Elizabeth, bap 17/3/1813 at St Giles without Cripplegate. ( I suggest this is Elizabeth) - father a carpenter Sophia Elizabeth, bap 21/12 1819 at Holborn St Giles in the Fields. (This one being Sophia and buried in 1827 aged 7) - father a cabinet maker Rosanna, bap 11/2/1818 at Holborn St Giles in the Fields - father a cabinet maker Henry William, bap 11/2/1818 at Holborn St Giles in the Fields - father a cabinet maker
I then found a death in Jersey City, NJ, for a 68 year old Joseph Glasson, on Feb 13 1853, a carpenter, born in England and died of West India fever.
In the same city some years earlier there was a marriage of a Joseph Glasson to Hannah Fuller - 29/7/1846.
This looks like the same Joseph but as yet I have not found him, or Sophia and children in the 1840 and 1850 US census.
I looked at the couple with whom he appears a witness with no connection. I still think it is Francis Pool that is more likely to link him to his Glasson family.
Lannanta
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Post by Cornish Terrier on May 2, 2015 2:51:45 GMT -5
If that were the case then I should think it would be a rather tenuous link. I have just spent some time poring over marriage records involving Francis Pool as either groom or witness and I can tell you that the Francis Pool who witnessed the marriage of Joseph and Sophia in 1810 was NOT the Francis Pool junr who married Eleanor Glasson. The Francis Pool witnessing the Joseph Glasson/Sophia Teague marriage had a signiature that is very much recognizable by the way he formed the 'F' and 'P' in his name and it is very different to that of the husband of Eleanor Glasson. In 1808 Francis Pool jnr witnessed two marriages and on the opposite page is the signiature of Joseph Glasson's witness wich is distinctively different. And it should be pointed out that the nearest known Joseph in Eleanor's family would be at best about a 2nd cousin. The marriages I have found involving this same Francis Pool as witness are:- 26th July 1808 Crowan - Edward Pooly and Mary Roberts 15th August 1809 Sithney - Joseph Pool of Crowan and Mary Sampson 11th September 1810 Gwennap - Joseph Glasson of Crowan and Sophia Teague 23rd March 1820 St Erth - Thomas Pool of Crowan and Mary Hawes 21st December 1825 Crowan - Phillip Richards junr. and Alice Pool 1st February 1831 Crowan - Richard Rosewarne of Gwinear and Eleanor Pool There is one more possible marriage witnessed by the same Francis Pool - 19th November 1818 between Emanuel Pool and Hannah Glasson. Unfortunately this image is missing from the FamilySearch collection. The signiature of Francis Pool when he married Alice Symons at Crowan 15th December 1882 is probably a close enough match to say that this is the man witnessing all the above marriages. The difficulty is that this same man is believed to be the father of the Francis Pool who married Eleanor Glasson in 1806. On that occasion there is a slight difference in his signiature in that the 'P' on the surname is completely different to the way he formed it in the other records. Of the marriages above the following were children of Francis Pool - Joseph (1809), Thomas (1820), James (1825) and although I don't have the image to confirm the signiature Francis was also the father of Emanuel (1818). And of course we have his son Francis who married Eleanor Glasson with she being sister to Emanuel Pool's wife Hannah. The Joseph Glasson I alluded to above as closest relation to Eleanor would be actually her first cousin who was baptized at Breage 24th January 1779 son of John and Blanch (nee Kemp) by my records. I'm afraid I can see nothing here to suggest any reason why Francis Pool should travel across to Gwennap to witness the marriage of Joseph Glasson. After all, Joseph's father John was still alive as was his brother John. CT
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Post by Deleted on May 2, 2015 18:35:39 GMT -5
Thanks for that CT you have spent a lot of time on studying the registers and I thank you for that. You say that Joseph's father and brother were still alive.. I guess by that you are convinced who the parents of Joseph Glasson who married Sophia are??? I am loath to rely on him being the son of John Glasson and Elizabeth Bottrall.... I think there is too much chance of it being in error to rely on it and move on..... I still think Francis Pool is in some way involved or linked to this however I accept that there is nothing that stands out..... and nothing that helps to determine who Joseph really is.... nagging away is the possibility of the baptism containing an error relating to parents as has been seen many times.... Looking at the children has been on my mind yesterday and today.... Caroline first appears in the Glasson family as a grand daughter of John Glasson and Elizabeth Bottrall - daughter of John and Jane TYACK and baptised at Sithney. At about the same time Emanuel Pool and Hannah Glasson named a daughter Caroline. Rosanna is a mystery. Sophia is obvious but Henry William is not so obvious. Henry provides the link to Paul with the marriage of Henry Glasson of Crowan to Sarah Boase of Paul. But why is there no son called John? or Joseph for that matter?? Lannanta
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Post by Cornish Terrier on May 2, 2015 23:35:29 GMT -5
No, not at all. That statement referred to the question of whether the Joseph who married Sophia Teague 'might' have been the one baptized at Breage in 1779 to John and Blanch. This John Glasson and his son John to my knowledge were both still alive at the time Joseph Glasson and Sophia Teague were married.
The Death record you found in NJ for a Joseph age 53 I think placed his birth around 1783 or 1784 which puts him between Joseph of 1779 and Joseph of 1788 which means he might have been either one or the other ....... or another as yet unidentified.
Sorry if I confused matters.
CT
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Post by zibetha on May 2, 2015 23:46:13 GMT -5
In researching Harvey and Semmons and related families in the Crowan and Gwinear areas, I wound up creating a spreadsheet of Roddas to avoid duplicate tree entries. There was a Matthew Rodda born circa 1715? who married Mary Davey in 1738 whom I think was the same Matthew who married Elizabeth Symons in 1762 in Crowan (banns were also posted in Breage.) I have not been able to identify this Elizabeth and hadn't thought of looking for a subsequent marriage for her.
I have suspected her husband, Matthew, was the man buried in Crowan in either 1772 or 1777. If he died in 1772, that would make it possible for his widow to have been the Elizabeth Rodda who married John Glasson in 1773. According to the marriage information on the OPC site, both marriages were witnessed by Henry Odger (established to have been parish clerk for 40+ years in one of "Donne's threads here) and... Joseph Symons. In that event, "Joseph" would have been a Symons/Semmons name rather than a Glasson one.
Also, re: Lannanta's idea that there is a Francis Pool (Sr.)connection, wasn't his wife Alice Symons whose father and grandfather were both named Joseph? As with Elizabeth mentioned above, these Symons were of Breage.
Zibetha
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Post by zibetha on May 4, 2015 1:49:00 GMT -5
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Post by Glazin2018 on Jan 19, 2019 0:26:57 GMT -5
CT
Just a couple of thoughts on this I get the sneaking suspicion that your option 3 is more than likely.
In 1775 John GLASSON married Alice GILBERT at Gwinear. In 1776 they had a daughter Mary at Sithney and in 1778 they had a son John at Paul. Then there just happens to be a burial for an Alice GLASSON at Paul in 1778 - on the 15th December, a day after the baptism of the John GLASSON just mentioned.
Then in 1779 at Paul, John GLASSON, a widower and a miller, sojourner of the Parish, married Elizabeth ROWLING and there are two children that could be attached to them.... a daughter Elizabeth born around 1780 at Camborne and of course Joseph baptised in 1788 at Gwinear.
Lannanta
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Jan 19, 2019 11:54:24 GMT -5
I don't have these people in my database but on reading the information a couple of times I tend to agree that you might be on the right track. The timeline certainly works as does the fact John Glasson was a sojourner.
I presume you have enough information on the other two marriages to be able to eliminate them from the scenario?
CT
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Post by Glazin2018 on Jan 19, 2019 15:25:16 GMT -5
Morning CT
Unfortunately with this era of the family there is little information to confirm things. Regarding the husband of Alice and Elizabeth, I have the signature from the Paul marriage but I do not have a copy of the Gwinear marriage to compare.
Regarding marriage two - John and Elizabeth Bottrall, I eliminated them for three reasons, first Joseph's baptism preceded the marriage, all other 11 baptisms were at Camborne, and there is no Joseph mentioned in a very complete will.
Regarding marriage one - John and the widow Elizabeth Rodda, I was not able to find a family for them at all.
I decided that this scenario fitted so well that I needed to move on with it.
Lannanta
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Jan 19, 2019 22:57:51 GMT -5
I have just looked at the Gwinear marriage which is, unfortunately, quite faded in places and difficult to read. However, I think there is enough to suggest that this is the same man who later married at Paul.
Although slightly different there is definite similarity in the way the 'J' is formed in both signiatures and the same applies to the following 'o' in the name John. The 'G' in the surname is a little different at the top but in both signiatures the 'la' is similar. Apart from that the remainder of the signiature at Gwinear is too faded to read with the exception of one very small mark at the end of the name.
Note in the Paul signiature that the last 'n' in Glasson is 'split' with the final mark appearing like a '2'. The Gwinear signiature appears to end in similar fashion although this time that small mark looks more like an 's'.
I will forward a copy of the image via email but I think there might be enough to suggest the same John Glasson was involved in both marriages.
CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Jan 31, 2019 4:39:16 GMT -5
Lannanta - another potential 'pot stirrer' for you to consider in relation to Joseph Glasson and Sophia Teague. From the St Allen Parish Register:- Joseph son of Robart Glazand baptized 21st May 1784I just came across this baptism and placed him as a probable son of Robert Glasson and Elizabeth Arthur. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Jan 31, 2019 22:38:35 GMT -5
The pot has stopped stirring! I just found the following in the St Allen PR:- 1784 burials June 1 Joseph son of Robert Glazamp (pauper) age 0That removes him from the equation as another possibility for the husband of Sophia Teague. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Feb 1, 2019 4:26:39 GMT -5
Re the family of Joseph and Sophia Glasson not being found in 1840/1850 US Census records - I just found a William H Glasson age 31 born England wife wife Anne age 32 and also born England in the 1850 Census in Cambridge Massachusetts. They have with them a daughter Anne born in Massachusetts about 1843/4 but the interesting thing is that William H Glasson was a cabinet maker.
It 'might' be that this is Henry William Glasson the son of Joseph and Sophia baptized at Holborn in 1818 along with sister Sophia Elizabeth.
Of course it might be a totally different man but still worth looking into I think.
CT
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