A Tale of Two Williams (MILL of Illogan)

[smills]

A looong while back, CT helped me with some clues to the parentage of my ggggrandfather William Mill of Illogan, who married Ann Spargo in 1809. There were two possibilities, and sending for William and Ann's marriage certificate would not help, because both fathers were also named William. Nor would using the ages given in Census records be conclusive, given how elastic stated ages were in those days. So I despaired of an answer.

Recently, however, I was made aware of and acquired some CDs with Illogan birth, marriage and burial records from parishchest.com, and with their help I have tentatively solved the problem. Of the two William MILLs:

One was the son of William Mill and Elizabeth Stodden, bp. 29 Jun 1784; the other was the son of William Mill and Mary Angove, bp. 2 Oct 1785.

One married Elizabeth Gray, 10 Oct 1807; the other married Ann Spargo, 3 Apr 1809.

One was buried 16 Jun 1831, aged 47; the other died Sep 1867, aged 82.

The longer-lived William was the husband of Ann Spargo: they appear in the 1841 and 1851 Censuses (in 1861 William appears as a widower). Whose son is he? Using the Illogan records, I filled in the families of the two Williams, their siblings' marriages and their children, and in the 1851 Census I found a record that I think provides an answer. In Carnkye, Illogan, is a household of 3 widows:

MILL, Elizth., Head, 66, Keeps a small shop, b. Wendron
MILL, Elizth., Sislaw, 82, Pauper Of 1/6 Per Week, b. St. Austell, Miner's widow
ROGERS, Mary, Niece, 46, Chur Woman, b. Redruth

William Mill the son of Elizabeth Stodden had a brother Edward who married Elizabeth Paynter in 1796; and they had a sister Susannah who married Matthew Rogers in 1803. Susannah and Matthew had a daughter Mary (bp. 1807) who married John Rogers in 1830. Assuming these 3 women are indeed the widows of William Mill, Edward Mill, and John Rogers, then the long-lived William must be the son of Mary Angove.

The CDs I mentioned include Baptisms 1720-1812 and 1813-1840, Pre-Civil Registration Marriages, and Burials 1813-1837. I heartily recommend them to anyone with a genealogical interest in Illogan!

[Cornish Terrier]

Good to hear from you again. And that looks like a job well done!

In fact I have just spent some time checking through the information and I tend to agree with you. But there are a couple of things I need to point out because they had me wondering if perhaps there might have been some errors.

Note that in the 1851 Census the elder Elizabeth Mill (possibly Elizabeth Paynter) states she was born at St Austell. I do have a bit of a problem with this as I cannot find a baptism at St Austell (or nearby) for an Elizabeth Paynter around the right time. It is possible she was born at St Austell but baptised in another Parish some distance from St Austell but the nearest match I can find is at St Ives and I very much doubt that she would be the right person.
I considered the possibility that Elizabeth may have been a second wife but I can find nothing to support that either. You may well be correct that she was the widow of Edward Mill but identifying exactly who she was may be a task for another day.

Also in 1851 the young Elizabeth (Gray) stated that she had been born at Wendron. No Wendron borders Stithians which is the only place I could find an Elizabeth Grey/Gray whose age might be a match. But in this case I was able to find Elizabeth in 1861, still at Carnkye, but this time stating her birthplace as Stithians. So Elizabeth was baptised at Stithians 10th April 1785 daughter of Henry Grey and Blanch (nee Collins) who married at Stithians in 1782.

The third member of this family in 1851 was niece Mary Rogers but I have to question whether you have identified her correctly as the daughter of Matthew and Susannah? I see that you have suggested she had married John Rogers in 1830 so it certainly may be her but it would be nice to have absolute proof. Unfortunately the marriage record is of little help stating only that Mary was a spinster. The witnesses were F. Stevens and James Rogers and it is possible James Rogers was her brother but I only have the D&CRS Transcript so I am not able to compare signiatures with a marriage record for James.

Keep up the good work and hopefully this will lead to more discoveries for you.

CT

[smills]

You are right. The Elizabeth Paynter who married Edward Mill in 1796 was most likely the one bp. 11 Jun 1768 in Redruth to Richard and Jane Thomas Paynter, who themselves m. 6 Sep 1756 in Redruth. I don't see where St. Austell comes in either. What the hay?!

Regarding Mary Rogers, however, I do find in the 1841 Census in Pool, Illogan:

ROGERS, John, 40, Copper Miner
ROGERS, Mary, 35
PEARCE, Ann, 90 (!)

Ann would have to be a grandmother or possibly a great-aunt of one of them (there is a ROGERS-PEARCE connection: Susanna Mill Rogers' sister Alice married William Pearce in 1802; actually I'm beginning to think EVERYONE is related one way or another!!). So I will have to see where that leads.

Also in 1841 there are, in Lower Ball, Illogan:

MILL, Elizabeth, 70, Pauper
MILL, Elizabeth, 55, Grocer
ROGERS, Grace, 15, Labourer at Mines

These must be the same two widows of 1851, and I believe Grace may have been another daughter of Matthew and Susanna, bp. Redruth 1 Feb 1825. Still not a firm proof but a clue anyhow.

BTW, curiously, four of the Mill-Stodden daughters seem to have married Rogerses: Elizabeth m. Thomas Rogers (1792), Ann m. Edmund Rogers (1794), Jane m. Henry Rogers (1796), and Susannah m. Matthew Rogers (1803).

[smills]

William Mill, Redux!

On my last attempt I was unable to positively identify the parents of my ggggrandfather William Mill; they were either William Mill and Elizabeth Stodden, or William Mill and Mary Angove.

Recently I revisited the widowed sisters-in-law Elizabeth Mill in Illogan, and decided to try a couple of different approaches. My hypothesis had been that they were Elizabeth Paynter and Elizabeth Gray, the widows of Edward Mill (b. 1771) and William Mill (b. 1784, d. 1831) respectively, who were both sons of William and Elizabeth Stodden Mill.


Approach (1): I had learned that in towns in early 19th Century America, family members often settled near each other, and I decided to ask if something similar could be the case here.

In the 1841 Census the widows were ages 70 and 55, living in Lower Ball just on the edge of Carnkye. (I've located Carnkie on the map but not Lower Ball; however, they must have been near each other because in 1851 the widows were still in the same place but now their residence was recorded as Carnkye.)

William and Elizabeth Stodden Mill's children included, besides sons Edward and William, daughters SUSANNAH (b. 1780, m. MATHEW ROGERS 27 Mar 1803) and GRACE (b. 1782, m. HENRY BENNETTS 30 Apr 1803).

Edward and Elizabeth Paynter Mill had sons EDWARD (bp. 23 Oct 1796) and THOMAS (bp. 20 Jan 1798).

Mathew and Susannah Mill Rogers had daughters SUSANNAH (bp. 14 Mar 1812), ANN (bp. 5 Nov 1814), and GRACE (bp. 1 Feb 1825).

All these families appear to have lived in Carnkye. I haven't yet identified a burial record for Edward (the Edward Mill of Carnkie bur. 26 Nov 1824 is 10 years too young), but those that I did find were:

MATHEW ROGERS, 26 Jun 1828, age 49
HENRY BENNETTS, 1 Jun 1830, age 53
WILLIAM MILL, 16 Jun 1831, age 47
SUSANNAH ROGERS, 2 Mar 1840, age 62

Now back to the widows Elizabeth Mill in 1841. Four dwellings previous to them are THOMAS and ELIZABETH MILL (both age 40) with 6 children: Thomas (15), Jacob (12), Elizabeth (10), William (8), Ann (6), and Grace (3). This couple is most likely the Thomas Mill and Elizabeth Thomas m. 2 Mar 1824 in Redruth, and he is possibly the son of Edward and Elizabeth (but there are other candidates: son of Thomas and Christian, bp. 12 Apr 1797; son of Thomas and Ann, bp. 17 May 1801).

Living with the widows is GRACE ROGERS (15). There are a couple of other possibilities for her identity also, but I think it likely that she is their niece, the orphaned daughter of Mathew and Susannah.

In the next dwelling are JOHN and SUSANNAH MENHENOT (both 25). John Menheniot m. Susannah Rogers 10 Sep 1836; her age has been rounded down from 29, but I don't see who she could be except Mathew and Susannah's daughter.

Eight dwellings below them are EDWARD (44) and ANN (46) MILL with 8 children: Henry (15), Ann (13), Elizabeth (11), Mary (9), Prescilla (7), Edward (5), Jane (3) and William (1). This couple I take to be the Edward Mill and Ann Martin m. 8 Jun 1822 in Illogan, and I don't see who he could be except the son of Edward and Elizabeth.

Two dwellings below Edward and Ann Mill are GRACE BENNETTS (60) and ANN ROGERS (20). I don't see who Grace could be but Henry Bennetts' widow. Ann is possibly her niece, also Mathew and Susannah's daughter -- although her actual age is 26 not 20, which is quite a bit of rounding down.

So, whether or not the two Elizabeth Mills are the widows of Mill-Stodden sons, they appear pretty firmly entrenched among Mill-Stodden relatives.


Approach (2): I posed another question: was there any other instance of two brothers named Mill, who both married women named Elizabeth, and had both died by 1841? Silly question -- of course there was! But fortunately for my sanity, they were way too young. (Gabriel Mill son of Gabriel and Hannah, b. 1806, m. Elizabeth Lawrence 5 Jan 1832, bur. 21 May 1834 age 29; and Edwin son of Gabriel and Hannah, b. 1810, m. Elizabeth Jelbart 25 Jan 1834, bur. 17 Apr 1836, age 26.)


It would be great if a will or some equally concrete evidence would come to light, but lacking that, I feel reasonably confident that the William Mill who died in Carnkye in 1831 was the son of William Mill and Elizabeth Stodden, and the William Mill who married Ann Spargo and lived until 1867, my ggggrandfather, was the son of William Mill and Mary Angove.

[smills]

Cutting the Gordian Knot!

Years ago now, I assembled a lot of circumstantial evidence as to the parentage of my ggggrandfather William Mill (son of William Mill and Elizabeth Stodden or William Mill and Mary Angove?). I concluded it was the latter, but still did not have concrete proof.

Since then I began putting up my family tree, and sent a DNA test, to Ancestry.com, and have recently begun exploring an amazing feature called ThruLines in Ancestry's DNA category. It revealed that I have 6 DNA matches to Elizabeth Stodden (that is, six people whose trees have them related to her) and 2 matches to her sister Charity Stodden. Elizabeth's husband William Mill (4 matches) had a brother Edmund (2 matches) and sister Elizabeth Ann (1 match). The caveat, of course, is that a person's tree represents who they *believe* they are descended from, and a given ancestor could be wrong, but my results include five different people. I cannot think that they are all wrong.

So I have to abandon my Mill-Angove hypothesis, but on the upside, it was a heck of a lot easier than digging through all those old records was!

[zibetha]

Dear "S" I will go first on this. For me, a combination of DNA testing combined with the paper trail search has been a wonder. I do not use the ThruLine feature, but my brother does, and I help him with his research and can see his results. So far not too much that I did not know on the Cornish side, but it has helped back up the history of a great-grandfather whose father died when he was 3 and his mother at about age 11. My great grandmother died when my mother was 4 year old, and we really knew nothing about the family. The data base works well on that branch.

I worked on my Mitchell line for many years and finally cracked it when I got a bunch of DNA matches that pointed me in the right direction. Just this weekend got 3 matches in Australia who descend from my great-great grandfather's brother William.

So I will say, use all of the tools available in your search.

Zib

[smills]

Thank you!