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Post by tenpoundpom on Oct 11, 2012 6:26:16 GMT -5
Christopher Trewhella (abt 1774) and Phillis Trewhella (abt 1783) had a few children, one of whom, William (abt 1812) is a direct ancestor. I'm trying to sort out William's sibs.
With some confidence I can trace my direct line back to William Trewhella (b. 1812), who was born in Lelant or Towednack, depending upon which way the wind blowed when a particular census was taken.
In October 1861 William married Martha Sincock, and there is robust evidence for how things panned after that.
I've found things a bit murky before the marriage date, so would appreciate any information or corrections on what I've found, surmised and extrapolated.
1851 Census...
William is an unmarried farmer in Gulval. In the same household is his sister Cathrine (abt 1814), also unmarried. She is recorded as his housekeeper.
His mother, Phillis (abt 1784) heads another household in Lelant. The adult children in the household are Christopher (abt 1810), Martin (abt 1821) & Elizabeth (abt 1824)
1841 Census…
William is living with his mother, along with Martin and Elizabeth in Lelant. There is another brother, Matthew (abt 1818). Neither Christopher nor Cathrine are there.
However we can find a household in St Hilary which has Christopher, Catharine and Martin Trewhella in it. Since relationships were not stated in 1841, it may be possible that Christopher & Cathrine were brother & sister, rather than husband and wife. If it is the same Christopher Trewhella he is recorded as being unmarried in the 1851 census (in Lelant), and Catharine is unmarried (in Gulval).
The spanner in the works is Martin Trewhella. Perhaps the one in St Hilary in 1841 is not a brother of Christopher and Cathrine as there is a Martin Trewhella in Phillis’s Lelant household at the same time. Perhaps he is a cousin working on the farm. Perhaps he has been double counted (different age brackets though!). Perhaps I'm barking up a wrong tree!
So, to summarise my thoughts....
Combining the info from the 1841 and the 1851 census the children of Christopher Trewhella (abt 1774) and Phillis Trewhella (abt 1784) seem to be Christopher (abt 1810), William (abt 1812), Catherine (abt 1814) Matthew (abt 1818), Martin (abt 1821) & Elizabeth (abt 1824). There are two Martin Trewhellas in relevant households in 1841 (? double counting ? cousins)
In addition…
An Ancestry tree also has another child…Phillis, as an older sister of William.
Before I dig deeper into Trewhella terrain I hope that the Trewhella family trailblazers can clarify some of this stuff – especially the Martin Trewhella double act, and the existence of Phillis the daughter.
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Post by sue on Oct 11, 2012 8:42:18 GMT -5
Welcome to PG! I think CT just might be able to provide you with some well-researched help on Trewhellas! Sue ......................................
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 11, 2012 9:53:46 GMT -5
Afraid I ran out of time to get to this post so will put some effort in later today to make sure I come up with all the right answers! The main thing I need to check is the group at Trevabyn, St Hilary in 1841 given the anomalies with Martin. I can verify that William Trewhella had an elder sister named Phillis and I will post some more on her tomorrow as well. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 12, 2012 3:38:19 GMT -5
I have taken a look at the Census records again and after another check through my database I can only conclude that Martin Trewhella was enumerated twice. That he is recorded in two places so far apart and with his age recorded as 20 in one place and 25 in the other is confusing to say the least but there can be little doubt. One thing I do not know is how or why this part of the family came to be at Trevabyn, St Hilary. Perhaps some more research for another day! As you are keen to research the family for yourself I will give you just brief details of the family of Christopher and Phillis for now. You can ask for further information at any time and I will help out of course but this way opens up possibilities that you may find a few bits and pieces that I may have missed! So the children are:- Phillis born 1806 Towednack Christopher born 1809 Lelant William born 1811 Lelant Catherine born 1814 Lelant Matthew born 1818 Lelant Martin born 1820 Lelant Elizabeth born 1823 Lelant Christopher and Martin were the only two that did not marry and you will find Christopher buried with his mother in Lelant Churchyard. You should be able to find information for all of these except perhaps Martin who is sure to give you some problems. Although I found the information around 30 years ago it did take me some time before I arrived at the conclusion that what I had found was the demise of Martin. I have not yet found details of his passage but information suggests that Martin Trewhella arrived in Victoria sometime around 1859. He may have moved around a bit and possibly even spent some time in New Zealand but it seems that most of his last years were spent in Northeast Victoria. Martin died near Tallangatta on October 10th, 1894. His body, along with his horse and dray, were found in a Lagoon and an Inquest found that Martin had drowned. He was buried at Tallangatta on October 12th. Interestingly - it was a Charles Mitchell who went in search of Martin when had failed to return from Tallangatta by about 1800hrs on the day he died. Martin had been working for a Mrs M Mitchell, sister-in-law to Charles, who I believe to have been the recently widowed wife of Matthew Mitchell. These Mitchells were two of six sons of John and Jane (nee Matthews) Mitchell from Zennor and John Mitchell was the son of Robert Michell and his wife Jane TREWHELLA who married at Towednack in 1797. And that means that, knowingly or unknowingly, Martin was working for the family of his first cousin once removed! Jane Trewhella, wife of Robert Michell, and Phillis Trewhella, wife of Christopher Trewhella, were sisters. CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Oct 12, 2012 5:47:39 GMT -5
Fascinating stuff, especially about mysterious Martin. You've encouraged me to keep digging!
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Post by tenpoundpom on Oct 21, 2012 6:09:27 GMT -5
Putting some flesh on the bones...
Hope it can be confirmed I'm on the right track in regards to BMD and child production.
Phillis (1806 - 1889) Married Richard Uren in 1833 and had 7 children Christopher (1809 - 1870) Never married William (1811 - 1871) Married Martha Sincock in 1861 and had 3 children, of which one, William Henry Trewhella is my direct ancestor. Catherine (1814 - 1891) Married Richard Richards in 1860. No children Matthew (1818 - 1898) Married Mary Roach in 1849 and had 7 children Martin (1820 - 1894) Never married. Died in Australia (thx CT!) Elizabeth (1823 - 1897). Married John Cooper in 1853. One child.
One loose end I would like to tie up is the death date/burial date of the father, Christopher who was baptised in Towednack in 1774. There is an Ancestry tree which gives a death year of 1823, and buried in Towednack, but there is no citation. I cannot find any online source to verify this. The closet online record I can find is a Christopher Trewhella buried at St Ives in 1821, age 48 (transcribed by one Ian Trewhella!). Is this the same Christopher Trewhella or not? Hope some light can be shed on the matter!
Thanks for any help.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 21, 2012 9:45:21 GMT -5
Missed .............. by that much! Richard and Phillis Uren had 8 children:- William (1834-1836) Philippa (1836-) Mary (1837-) Catherine (1839-) William (c.1841-) Christopher Trewhella (1843-1913) Elizabeth (c.1845-) Ann Trewhella (1850-) John and Elizabeth Cooper had 2 children:- Elizabeth Trewhella (1855-1856) William John (1857-1931) Christopher Trewhella was buried at Towednack 4th March 1823 at the age of 48. This entry is in the CFHS Burial Index but I also saw the record in the Towednack Parish Register at the Cornwall Record Office in 1994. CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Oct 22, 2012 3:29:45 GMT -5
Thanks for filling in the gaps. Next step backwards is Christopher (b 1774) and Phillis (b1783). I have some info but there is more to be mined (pathetic attempt at Cornish occupational pun). Christopher's parents are Martin Trewhella and Joan Lembery methinks, and Phillis has William Trewhella and Ann Cock. The next project will be to track down as many sibs of Christopher and Phillis that I can. Stumbling blocks are sure to arise, and another scream for help is likely to be heard before too long.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 22, 2012 3:34:02 GMT -5
You have the correct parents for both Christopher and Phillis so I will let you work from there to see what you come up with. Call for help or confirmation (or otherwise) at any time. CT
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Post by Glazin2018 on Oct 6, 2019 4:00:10 GMT -5
Good morning
Maybe 9 children?
There was a Richard Uren who was born and died at Coombe in 1849.
My question CT concerns the elder Richard Uren here - born 1805 or thereabouts. Do you have his father as Thomas Uren..... and if so I can't help but wonder why none of his sons bear that name.
Lannanta
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 6, 2019 9:51:21 GMT -5
Quite correct with the children - son Richard was baptized in April 1849 probably at Polpear Wesleyan Chapel. As for the parents of Richard senior - although I have not looked at this family for some time I am also a little curious as to why there would be no son named Thomas. There is certainly a daughter name Catherine but even in her case it is curious that there were two daughters born prior to her. First of those was named Philippa after her mother but then the name Mary was used for the next daughter. The difficulty is that except for the son of Thomas and Catherine in 1806 there is no record of another Richard Uren baptized anywhere near Lelant between 1800 and 1810 who could possibly be involved. As the first child of Richard and Phillis was named William and another son was given that name in 1841 it would have been more logical to expect Richard's father to have been a William Uren. But there were only two William Urens baptizing children in the general area around that time - William Uren and Mary Broad from about 1795 through about 1810 at St Erth is the first but that family had no Richard. The other family was that of William Uren and Margaret Penberthy who baptized children at Lelant from 1796 to 1810. This may be the same William and Margaret who baptized a daughter Mary at Phillack in 1806 in which case Richard could not possibly have been their son. According to all records Richard was born 1805-7 yet William and Margaret had no Richard but during the years 1804, 1805, 1808 and 1810 at Lelant they baptized Margaret, Jennifer, Elizabeth and William and it now appears also Mary at Phillack in late 1806. Also notable when considering William and Margaret is that Richard had five daughters yet none was named Margaret either. Despite not naming a son Thomas the only option appears to be that Richard Uren was indeed the son of Thomas Uren and Catherine Laity and that he was baptized at Lelant 31st August 1806. The one remaining consideration is that perhaps Richard was illegitimate but I can find no obvious candidate. The final thing to throw into the mix is that Richard and Phillis were located mostly at Coombe/Polpeor. If you check the other children of Thomas Uren and Catherine Laity you will see that eldest son Thomas died at Polpeor as did his wife Jane (Warmington). Son George died at Coombe in 1864, son William died at Coombe in 1828, Thomas himself died at Polpeor in 1827 and Catherine at Ninnes Bridge near Polpeor back in 1827. I am certainly interested if you have anything at all that might suggest another solution but I can see no alternative based on what information I currently have. CT
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Post by Glazin2018 on Oct 6, 2019 12:07:15 GMT -5
CT
I was sort of accepting Thomas as the father but I kept having that nagging doubt due to the name William being so prevalent. MY info is back from when I first started so I have nothing to add. In fact could I trouble you for the full complement of Thomas and Catherine's children please because I have at least George and William missing.
A sunny day today at St Ives which was a blessing after endless wet and showery ones.
Lannanta
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 6, 2019 23:52:04 GMT -5
I presume you are aware that Thomas Uren has not yet been positively identified. All I have currently is that he was born about 1762 with that information based on his age at burial in 1827.
The list of children I have is as follows:-
1. Thomas (1790-1853) m. Jane Warmington at Lelant in 1818 2. Vincent (1791-) 3. Elizabeth (1794-1795) 4. Elizabeth (1796-) m. John Uren at Lelant 1820 (John bp. 1799 Lelant son of John Uren and Hannah Michell) 5. George (1798-1864) m. Mary Ann Trevorrow at Lelant in 1825 6. Vincent (1799-) 7. Catherine (1802-1823) m. Edward Warmington at Lelant in 1823 and died shortly after. 8. William (1804-1828) 9. Richard (1806-1883) m. Phillis Trewhella at Lelant in 1833 10. Sarah (1808-) m. Thomas Warmington at Lelant in 1834
All events were at Lelant.
I have the complete dates for all these events if you need them and I have the children from most of the marriages.
CT
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Post by Glazin2018 on Oct 7, 2019 9:25:42 GMT -5
CT
Yes I sort of got that impression .... Richard with a probable naming pattern surprise and the only likely candidate for Thomas appears to be son of Edmund and Elizabeth which is why I was looking for an Edmund in his children - but no. At least Vincent gets us in the right ballpark.
Also assuming that the inclusion of George in this group of children comes from the Laity side.. likely Catherine's father?
Lannanta
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Oct 7, 2019 14:24:03 GMT -5
Yes, I believe Catherine was the daughter of George and Catherine Laity - very likey George Laitey and Catherine Phillips who married at Breage in 1759.
Now that you bring up the possibility of Thomas Uren being the son of Edmond there is another 'standout' in the children of Thomas and Catherine - successive daughters named Elizabeth with both also being the first and second daughters of Thomas and Catherine Uren. Given the next daughter was given the name Catherine this becomes somewhat suggestive!
CT
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