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Post by tenpoundpom on Sept 20, 2012 6:36:00 GMT -5
Thanks for the welcome a couple of days ago by Tonkin and Cornish Terrier on the Intro page
Thought I'd post my connection to the Trewhellas, and where my research is heading.
My maternal GM is Doris Trewhella (b 1903, Mawgan-in-Meneage). Her sibs were William John (1902), Phillis (1906), Annie (1907), Edith (1909) & Francis G (1917). All born in M-in-M.
Doris's father is William Henry Trewhella (b 1865) and mother Catherine (Kate) Edwards Pascoe (1874).
William Henry is one of 3 children, all born in Gulval. Sisters Annie (1864) & Philippa (1868).
William Henry's father is William Trewhella (1812-1871). William was born in Lelant, and was married to Martha in 1861 in Helston. Martha's maiden name is likely Sincock.
Although I'm fairly confident about the information above, I'm less confident about my further diggings..
I suspect William is a son of Phillis Trewhella (1783 - 1864) (and that may be her maiden name as well as married name). In 1841 Phillis is living in Uny Lelant. With her in the household are several individuals of an age to be her children - Matthew, William, Martin and Elizabeth. There is no man of an age to be her husband, so she may be widowed. There is another son - Christopher (b1810), who reappears in the 1851 census, so he was probably working elsewhere in 1841. By 1851 my man William has moved to Gulval, but Christopher, Martin & Elizabeth remain in Lelant with Phillis.
The 1851 census also records Phillis as being born in Towednack. I suspect that she was married to Christopher Trewhella (1774 - 1823), also of Towednack.
I am awaiting a couple of certificates Philippa (1868) birth cert to confirm mother's maiden name - likely Sincock
William (1812) marriage certificate to confirm wife's maiden name - likely Sincock and importantly father's name - likely Christopher. I may be grateful that William decided to delay marriage until civil registration was established!
It will be interesting to see what turns up.
If CT, or anyone else has some information to help me confirm/refute/ or enlarge on this material I'd be interested to hear. I hope with your help I can dig further!
Simon
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Sept 20, 2012 7:48:09 GMT -5
G'day Simon - I can certainly help you with most of this and I am sure that you are going to be able to help me! From what you say here you would be a grandson of Bertie Grigg Thuell so I will be looking to you for any information from the marriage onwards. I have just basic information about this family from the marriage of William Trewhella to Catherine Pascoe onwards but I believe I did have contact many years ago with Phyllis Kendall (Frances Phyllis Trewhella). Now the first thing you want to know is about the parents of William Henry Trewhella:- William Trewhella was baptised at Lelant 27th October 1811 son of Christopher Trewhella and Phyllis Trewhella who were married at Towednack 22nd December 1804 Christopher and Phyllis were first-cousins but we can progress to that part of the family later. In fact I have been discussing them earlier tonight with Sandra Quick who is also a new member and related to this same family. William Trewhella married Martha Sincock at Mawgan in Meneage 20th October 1861 and had just the three children you have mentioned. We can discuss the siblings of William also a little later but the family you have identified with Phyllis in the Census is correct. Christopher senior was buried at Towednack in 1848 and son Christopher died unmarried in 1870. He and his mother are buried in Lelant Churchyard. Looks like we are going to have quite a bit to talk about and information to share but I will leave it at that just for now so you can collect some thoughts and I can try and complete some work I am doing on another part of the family at the moment. CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Nov 6, 2012 4:28:23 GMT -5
I won't start any more new errant threads, I promise With the guidance of CT I have got back to the parents of Phillis Trewhella (1783 - 1864) who are William Trewhella and Ann Cock. CT pulled me out of some holes I had dug for myself in the Martin Trewhella/ Joan Lembery line so I expect that he will be able to do the same for me with this branch. I hope I don't marry off a brother to a sister again! . First cousins will be as close as it gets. Firstly, I hope I haven't made a "cock up" in regard to Ann Cock's place in the scheme of things. I have her as being baptised in Gwithian in 1741, and then married to William Trewhela in Towednack, New Years eve 1767. I cannot find a burial record. I hope that I have the "right" Ann Cock in the baptism record, but not sure why I can't find a record of the burial. The next hole I am digging for myself is in relation to the number and names of the children who William and Ann had. I have these as definites - William (1771 - 1846), Catharine (1773 - ), Mary (1774 - ), Jane (1777 - ), Matthew (1779 - ), Elizabeth (1781 - ) and Phillis ( 1783 - 1864). I think I have worked out most of the spouses of these kids (Glassons, Michells, Trewhellas, and a Daniel) and some of their children. As a probable I have Alice (1770 - ). She is recorded in the Towednack baptisms with William Trewhella and Alice as parents. I think either there was an error in the original register or by the transcriber and that the mother is really Ann. ?Thoughts As a possible I have Ann (1868 - ). There are some Ancestry trees which list her as a daughter. I know that Ancestry trees can be a minefield of misinformation, and that the misinformation can be propogated from one tree to another. I cannot find any record for Ann, but maybe I haven't looked in the right places. Given the family naming patterns, a first daughter named Ann would not be unexpected. Any light which can be shown would be gratefully appreciated!
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 6, 2012 8:24:07 GMT -5
The curse of the scant availability of Towednack records strikes again! Ann Cock baptised 2nd November 1741 Gwithian daughter of Robert Cock and Mary (nee Roberts) is correct and she married William Trewhella at Towednack 31st December 1767. Ann Trewhella of Towednack age 79 was buried at Towednack 13th February 1720 (Courtesy of a visit to the CRO in 1994) The children are as follows:- 1. Anne born c.1768 and most likely at Towednack Richard Morrish married Anne Trewhella of Towednack 1st January 1791 at Zennor 2. Alice daughter of William and Anne Trewheela baptised 29th April 1770 (Bishops Transcripts) Both the PR and the Hoblyn Transcript show the mother as Alice which is incorrect. She married Matthew Trewhella at Towednack 12th January 1793 3. William baptised 2nd June 1771 at St Ives William Trewhella married Ann Glasson 10th June 1797 at Lelant 4. Catherine baptised 3rd January 1773 at Towednack She married William Trewhella 29th January 1792 at Towednack 5. Mary baptised 28th December 1774 at St Ives Samuel Michell, joiner of Zennor, married Mary Trewhella 27th September 1796 at Towednack 6. Jane baptised 18th May 1777 Towednack Robert Michell, yeoman of Zennor, married Jane Trewhella 5th June 1797 at Towednack 7. Matthew baptised 14th March 1779 Towednack married Martha Daniel 2nd August 1801 at Towednack 8. Elizabeth baptised 29th April 1781 Towednack John Glasson, blacksmith of Lelant, married Elizabeth Trewhella 1st March 1800 at Towednack 9. Phillis baptised 23rd November 1783 Towednack (And of course you know about her!) In your efforts to try and track these families it is possible there is one link that you may miss. That link can be found around Sennen, St Levan and St Buryan but rather than 'spoil some fun' I will let you take a look at it to see if you can work out where the family fits. CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Nov 11, 2012 4:49:32 GMT -5
CT, Thanks for confirming Ann Cock's birth deatils and the existence of Ann. I've been trying to work out the grandchildren of William Trewhella and Ann Cock. At the end of the day at the fair there are possibly a few children who have been sent home with the wrong parents and there are likely to be a few abandonded in the "Lost Children" tent as well...So here's my work in progress...William and Ann's children in order of birth with spouses and offspring
1.Anne Trewhella & Richard Morrish (m 1791, Zennor) Anne Morrish (1792) Richard Morrish (1793) Elizabeth Murrish (1797) William Morrish (1799) Thomas Murrish (1801) Matthew Murrish (1803) Jane Murrish (1806) Job Murrish (1809)
I have had little success in tracking this family further. Maybe I have added children who don't belong etc. I have found a Richard Morrish,from Cornwall,who was sentenced to death for horse stealing in 1819. Seems likely commuted to transportation for life to Tasmania ( a fate worse than death some would say!....kidding,I lived in Tassie for a year and loved it!),but if this is the Richard married to Anne he would have been 15-16 at time of marriage, and since there is no age on the marriage record I would have expected him to be "of full age" at the time of marriage. Maybe barking up a wrong tree! Grateful for help in straigthening out any misconceptions for this line.
2. Alice Trewhella & Matthew Trewhella (m 1793, Towednack) Matthew Trewhella (1793) John Trewhella (1796) Alice Trewhella (1799) Christopher Trewhella (1802) Johanna Trewhella (1805) Ann Trewhella (1808) Martin Trewhella (1810)
Kissing cousins!
3. William Trewhella & Ann Glasson (m 1797, Lelant) William Trewhella (1798) Matthew Trewhella (1803) Christopher Trewhella (1805) Martin Trewhella (1809) Ann Trewhella (1812)
4. Catharine Trewhella & William Trewhella (m 1792, Towednack) William Trewhella (1792) Martin Trewhella (1794) Catharine Trewhella (1797) Mary Trewhella (1800) Matthew Trewhella (1802) John Trewhella (1805) Jane Trewhella (1808) Ann Trewhella (1815)
More kissing cousins!
5. Mary Trewhella & Samuel Michell ( m 1796, Towednack) Samuel Michell (1798) William Michell (1801) Robert Michell (1806) Daniel Michell (1809) Mary Michell (1812)
6 Jane Trewhella & Robert Michell (m 1797, Towednack) Robert Michel (1798) William Michel (1802) Jane Michel (1805) Polly Michel (1807) John Michell (1809) Ann Michell (1812) Kitty Michell (1814) Matthew Michell (1818) Samuel Mitchell (1820)
7 Matthew Trewhella & Martha Daniels (m 1801, Towednack) Catherine Trewhella (?) Matthew Trewhella (1802) Martha Trewhella (1804) William Trewhella (1807) Eliza Trewhella (1809) John Trewhella (1811) Christopher Trewhella (1813) James Trewhella (1815) Martin Trewhella (1818) Margaret Trewhella (1823)
8 Elizabeth Trewhella & John Glasson ( m 1800, Towednack) John Glasson (1800) Jacky Glasson (1805) Elizabeth Glasson (1808) Ann Glasson (1811) Christian Glasson (1814) Eliza Glasson (1816) Phillis Glasson (1823)
9 Phillis Trewhella & Christopher Trewhella (m 1804, Towednack)
We've been through this line before!
I am intrigued about the familial "missing link", and will attempt more sleuthing. Hopefully you've supplied enough hints!!. I'll let you know if I've torn off the remaining hairs on my head on the quest!
Simon
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 11, 2012 6:39:58 GMT -5
A long list this one!
The group of children for Richard and Ann Morrish is substantially correct as I know it except there was certainly one more daughter.
Elizabeth bp. 6th December 1795 Zennor and buried 6th January 1796 Towednack 'daughter of Richard and Ann Morrish from Zennor'.
There 'may' also have been another Ann although I suspect more likely that she was baptised twice.
Anne daughter of Richard Morrish baptised 8th August 1791 Zennor
The marriage was in January 1791 and then there is the baptism for Ann at Towednack in February 1792 so the second baptism scenario does look the most likely.
Richard Morrish age 68 was buried 14th October 1826 at Ludgvan but I have not yet been able to determine when Ann died.
Of the children I have found marriages for all except two - Elizabeth died in 1813 so never married and I don't know what happened to Thomas. All the rest were married at St Ives except for Ann at Zennor and William at Redruth.
CT
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Post by sue on Nov 11, 2012 6:49:14 GMT -5
Then I think you may have missed a few of my GGGGparents Elizabeth Trewhella & John Glasson's children: what about William 1802 Lelant who went on to marry Margaret Grenfell; the young Elizabeth who was buried there in 1806; Josiah 1819 Lelant who goes on to lead an interesting life..... Sue
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 11, 2012 6:52:15 GMT -5
Simon - unfortunately I can't sort out the rest without divulging the link! The children of Alice and Catherine are all correct - presuming you have the right baptism information recorded. For the rest I will copy and paste your list for each family below and then add in or amend where needed. 5. Mary Trewhella & Samuel Michell ( m 1796, Towednack) Samuel Michell (1797-1797)Samuel Michell (1798) William Michell (1801) John Michell (1804)Robert Michell (1806) Daniel Michell (1809) Mary Michell (1812) Jane Michell (1815-1875)Ann Michell (1819-1876)6 Jane Trewhella & Robert Michell (m 1797, Towednack) Robert Michel (1798) Daniel Michell (1800-1821)William Michel (1802) Jane Michel (1805) Polly Michel (1807) John Michell (1809) Ann Michell (1812) Kitty Michell (1814) Matthew Michell (1818) Samuel Mitchell (1820) 7 Matthew Trewhella & Martha Daniels (m 1801, Towednack) Matthew Trewhella (1802) Martha Trewhella (1804) William Trewhella (1807) Eliza Trewhella (1809) John Trewhella (1811) Christopher Trewhella (1813) James Trewhella (1815) Martin Trewhella (1818) Catherine Trewhella (1820-1897)Margaret Trewhella (1823) 8 Elizabeth Trewhella & John Glasson ( m 1800, Towednack) John Glasson (1800) William Glasson (1802)Elizabeth Glasson (c.1803-1806)Jacky Glasson (1805) Elizabeth Glasson (1808) Ann Glasson (1811) Christian Glasson (1814) Eliza Glasson (1816) Josiah Glasson (1819)Phillis Glasson (1823) And I've left William until last ............... for good reason! 3. William Trewhella & Ann Glasson (m 1797, Lelant) William Trewhella ( 1798) [_____________________] <======Matthew Trewhella ( 1803) Christopher Trewhella (1805) Martin Trewhella (1809) Ann Trewhella (1812) I will send you something via email that will help with a couple of the 'new' items. CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Nov 13, 2012 7:53:38 GMT -5
Much thanks to you (and Sue) for filling in the missing gaps. It is appreciated! I'll take it that the William Trewhella/ Ann Glasson blank spot is my quest!
For Sue, greetings from Australia. Seems like we are distant cousins! Visited Cambridgeshire a couple of years ago. An old friend of mine lives in Reach. Might be paying another trip next year.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 13, 2012 8:21:37 GMT -5
I've been trying to convince everyone that we Aussies are clever! I will be interested in your thoughts on this once you have found the likely connection. And it is more interesting because descendants of the Trewhella family from Bendigo told me over thirty years ago that they understood they were cousins to my family from the Trentham area. CT
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Post by tenpoundpom on Nov 19, 2012 2:49:20 GMT -5
Thanks to CT for the redlight specials in the list of children and the emailed material.
I'm working on the "missing link". I'm posting this to see if I'm on the right track.
CT gave me a couple of clues..Firstly about some Cornish locations, and secondly that some Trewhellas from Bendigo may be related some Trewhellas from Trentham. So my first task was to sort out which Trewhellas from Cornwall ended up in Trentham. Anyway got that sorted....brothers William and Benjamin...of Trewhella monkey jack fame.
The task ahead was to tie up a circa 1800 connection back in Cornwall, to separate Trewhella lines in Victoria. I'm not sure if I've made the right connection, but here goes!
In the 1841 census there is a household in Buryan with Ann Trewhella (abt 1801) and Sophia Trewhella (abt 1829) as its only inhabitants. Taking this on board... An OPC search shows Sophia Trewhela, a base child, baptised on 30 August 1829 in Gwinear. Mother is Ann, residence in Buryan. In the 1951 census John G Beryman (abt 1829) has moved in. He is listed as a nephew. Ann is listed as being born abt 1795. That's fine, given the age rounding in the 1841 census. Ann is listed as unmarried, born in St Buryan. Sophia is born in Gwinier. By the 1861 census Sophia has flown the coop. Ann is living alone in Buryan. Interestingly she is listed as a widow.
By now I know that,if I'm on the right track, the connection between the two Australian Trewhella lines will be via Sophia. I think that this is a little concerning because if she marries,
her children will have her husbands surname. So to carry on the Trewhella name Sophia either has to marry another Trewhella, or have base children.
So of course she marries her cousin...... but not a Trewhella cousin. It's the cousin who came to stay in 1851, John Berryman. The marriage record is most interesting. The father of the bride is listed as Edward Trewhella, a farmer. What the hell! When did he turn up! Does he even exist or is he an imaginary father to sanitise the marriage record?
John Berryman and Sophie Trewhella board the ship "Australia" in Plymouth on 14th October 1855 and arrive in Adelaide on 22nd January 1856 on their way to Port Phillip, Victoria. Presumably came seeking their fortune on the goldfields.
John Berryman dies in Bendigo in 1865. Parents are listed on tombstone as Richard Berryman and Grace Lawry. On his baptism record the parents are Richard and Grace, so I think I've tracked the same John Berryman.
So I've made a Buryan to Bendigo connection, but there are loose ends in each location. If Sophia is related to William Trewhella and Ann Glasson, the the missing link must be her mother Ann Trewhella, or her "father" Edward Trewhella. Since William and Ann have a daughter named Ann in 1812, I think it is more likely that the missing link is Edward Trewhella. But that is as far as I've got.
At the Bendigo end a descendant of John Berryman and Sophia Trewhella (who would be a Berryman) has to marry into the Bendigo Trewhella family to complete the link. Again I've not researced this further so far.
I'm not even sure I've got the right connection (Sophia), but hopefully CT will cast his eye on this jumble of information and tell me whether I am on the right track. If so, I'll continue to try and tie up the loose ends. If not, I'll abandon all hope and admit defeat!
Simon
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 19, 2012 9:47:09 GMT -5
Well, the cigar box remains tightly sealed! When I set the 'quest' I must admit that I had forgotten about Ann and her little brood but it is nice to see that you found them and were able to identify Sophia's husband John Berryman. Edward Trewhella most certainly existed but he was not the father of any of Ann's children! Edward was born at Crowan in 1786 son of Thomas Trewhella and Martha (nee Blewett). He married Ann (Nanny) Berryman at St Buryan 29th March 1813 and died four years later. Edward was buried at Crowan 10th May 1817 at the age of 31. The first of Ann's illegitimate children was baptised at St Buryan 1st July 1821. He was Uriah Samuel Trewhella but lived just 4 months and died at Falmouth where he was buried on 8th November 1821. The second child was Theophilus Trewhella for whom I have never been able to find a baptism. Theophilus also came to Australia and settled at Buninyong near Ballarat. He married Elizabeth Hill at Buninyong in 1858 and died there in 1912. Sophia was the last of Ann's children and you have identified her marriage and voyage to Australia with husband John Berryman. Sophia and John had just two children - John born in Melbourne in 1856 died in 1857 at the age of 14 months and Richard who was born in 1858 and lived just three days. Sophia also died in 1858 and I suspect around the same time as her son. That then eliminates any possible link between Sophia and Trentham and I can tell you that the family of her brother Theophilus remained at Buninyong. So you have more hunting to do yet. CT
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Post by zibetha on Nov 19, 2012 23:48:25 GMT -5
As my niece would say "hmmmm...." now you have got my attention.
TPP, Edward was the younger brother of my 4x great-grandmother, Anne Trewhela (we seem to be the one "L" branch but members married into the "LL's" from time to time, and they (LL's) drifted into the neighborhood Crowan-Gwinear alighting on neighboring farms too often for it to be a fluke.
And really , CT, another "Theophilus" -- can that be a coincidence? Didn't that name pop up recently as descendents of Malachy Trewhella? Quite a unique name that I have not found on "my" line previously or have seen much at all.
Intrigiued,
Z
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 20, 2012 5:22:28 GMT -5
Hello Zibetha - yes, the Theophilus name is intriguing and I have puzzled over it before. I have long suspected a 'possible' link between the Towednack Trewhella family and those at Camborne and Crowan and that is largely because of the names Christopher and Matthew. Unfortunately there is nothing so far that has been found to provide any proof of that suspected link. It should also be kept in mind that the name Theophilus turns up in two Trewhella (sic.) families almost simultaneously around 150 years after the commencement of the earliest known extant Crowan registers. It should also be noted that Crowan provides the names Matthew and Thomas as possible links to Towednack but Helston/Wendron provide Christopher. Another anomaly is that Ann Trewhella was a widow when her illegitimate son Theophilus came along whilst the descendant of Malachy was the son of a Baptist Minister. BUT! - I do find it interesting that widowed Ann Trewhella buried her first child (Uriah Samuel) at Falmouth in 1821 and then son Theophilus was born around 1826 back home at St Buryan. Falmouth is where some descendants of Malachy settled and it is where his son Henry (the Baptist Minister) was married in 1812. But Henry's son Theophilus was born around 1827 probably in the North of England. My thinking is that the use of the name Theophilus was more a quincequonce than anything else but it is still most certainly intriguing. And don't forget that the spelling of the name largely depended on the person responsible for recording it! Then there is the case of one particular family where two brothers ended up with one using TREWHELLA and the other using TREWHEELA! - FACT! CT
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Post by andrewwa on Nov 20, 2012 5:41:14 GMT -5
G’day tenpoundpom
John Berryman married SophiaTrewhella in St Just in Penwith on 5 Oct 1855 (OPC) his father was Richard Berryman – Miner, and Sophia’s father was given as Edward Trewhella – Farmer. CT advises that Edward died in 1817.
This John Berryman is very likely the John Berryman who was baptised in St Just in Penwith on 12 July 1834. His parents were Richard & Grace Berryman. Richard Berryman married Grace Lawry in St Just on 6 Dec 1806.
The John Berryman who died in Bendigo in 1865 had parents Richard Berryman and Grace Lawry/Lowry – this confirms the marriage record. He was 41 when he died which confirms the baptism.
The John G Berryman who was residing with Ann and Sophia Trewhella in Buryan in 1861 was 29yo and born in St Buryan. John George Berryman was baptised in St Buryan on 21 Oct 1827. His parents were John and Margaret Berryman who were residing on Trevedran. He is likely to be the nephew of Ann Trewhella but not the wife of her daughter Sophia.
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