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Post by marychown on Dec 20, 2010 5:25:06 GMT -5
I have finally found a burial record for Mary Calf nee Alexander, wife of Jonathan Calf and mother of Philip Hall Calf. According to Medway online records, Mary Calf, wife of Jonathan Calf, was buried at St. Mary Magdalene, Gillingham, Kent on 1 January 1763. Her youngest child, William Calf, was buried there on the same day. He had only been baptised at the same church three days earlier on 29 December 1762.
Jonathan Calf must have returned to Fowey with his surviving children (Mary Calf, Jonathan Calf, Philip Hall Calf and Elizabeth Calf) in 1763 where on 23 September 1763 Jonathan married Anne Adams nee Bunt. Phillimore records the marriage of Jonathan Calf, Widower, & Anne Adams, Widow. I could never find a previous marriage for Jonathan Calf till his marriage to Mary Alexander at Gillingham was discovered a short while ago.
Another brick wall has finally fallen!
Mary
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 21, 2010 5:51:53 GMT -5
Well done Mary! Unusually I now find that I had not added this family to my database but I am happy to have been of some help in finding the answers. CT
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Post by marychown on Dec 21, 2010 7:02:06 GMT -5
Thanks, CT! A few months ago we discussed the possibility that Philip Calf may have been Philip Halls, son of Elizabeth Calf (Jonathan Calf's sister) and her husband Philip Halls (Halse) who had changed his name to Calf.
It is of particular interest that a Philip Hall Calf was baptised at Gillingham on 23 April 1759 and again at Chatham on 6 May 1759. Philip Halls was baptised at Fowey on 27 July 1755 to Philip Halls (Halse) and his wife Elizabeth nee Calf.
Although I have not been able to find a burial record, I think it is a possibility that the young Philip Halls may have died and that Philip Hall Calf was baptised in Kent in memory of his young cousin or perhaps in memory of his uncle - again no relevant burial record found.
Mary
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Post by marychown on Aug 3, 2011 2:05:46 GMT -5
After a break of several months I am returning to a very complicated family to try to make some sense of it. Thanks to help from CT and Londoner it has been established that Philip Hall Calf (baptised at Gillingham, Kent 23 April 1759; married Rebecca Ford at St. Hilary 30 Aug 1782; buried St Michael's Mount 16 Aug 1791) was the son of Jonathan Calf and Mary Alexander who were married at St. Mary Magdalene, Gillingham 3 Nov 1747). Their marriage entry can just about be read in the middle column half way down the page under marriages for the year 1747: cityark.medway.gov.uk/query/results/?Mode=ShowImg&Img=/cityark/Scans/Ecclesiastical_Rochester_Archdeaconry_Area_Parishes/P153_GILLINGHAM_ST_MARY_MAGDALENE_1558_1986/01_Incumbent_Church_Registers_1558_1976/P153_01_02.html/00000232.jpgFrom the Gillingham and Chatham records it can be ascertained that five children were baptised for this couple: Mary Calf bapt. Gillingham 9 May 1756; buried Gillingham 29 Mar 1757; Jonathan Calf bapt. Gillingham 25 Sep 1757 (also Chatham 16 Oct 1757); PHILIP HALL CALF bapt. Gillingham 23 Aor 1759 (also Chatham 6 May 1759); Elizabeth Calf bapt. Gillingham 17 Feb 1761; William Calf bapt. Gilingham 29 Dec 1762; buried Gillingham 1 Jan 1763 along with his mother Mary who was also buried there on the same day. All the above records can be found at Medway CityArk as well as on Family Search.org. I wonder what could be the explanation for the gap of some nine years before Jonathan and Mary Calf baptised their first child? I am also perplexed at the age Jonathan was when he married. Jonathan Calf was almost certainly John Calf baptised to William Calf and his wife Elizabeth nee Marks at Fowey on 3 Feb 1735. William Calf had two earlier sons also baptised John Calf at Fowey on 30 Apr 1723 (buried at Fowey on 11 Sep 1728) and John Calf bapt. Fowey 25 May 1731 (buried at Fowey on 18 Feb 1732). Obviously John/Jonathan Calf baptised at Fowey on 3 Feb 1735 was born some time after 18 Feb 1732 and I would have thought after 31 July 1733 when his sister Martha was buried at Fowey - otherwise surely the two children would have been baptised on the same day. So John/Jonathan Calf who married Mary Alexander must surely have been born about 1734/1735 thereby making him just twelve or thirteen years old at the time of his Gillingham marriage on 3 Nov 1747!!! It is more than likely that Philip's father Jonathan comes from that family because John/Jonathan Calf had a sister Elizabeth Calf baptised at Fowey in February 1726 who married Philip Halls at Fowey on 29 April 1749 and this couple also had a son called Philip Halls baptised at Fowey on 27 July 1755. It is extremely likely that Jonathan and Mary Calf named their son PHILIP HALL CALF after Jonathan's brother-in-law or nephew Philip Halls. Also, their children's names fit - Jonathan and Mary for the couple themselves and Elizabeth and William for Jonathan's parents. Following the death of his wife Mary and baby son William, Jonathan Calf returned with his three surviving children to live in Fowey in 1763. On 23 Sep 1763 Jonathan married Anne Adams nee Bunt at Fowey. At the time of the marriage according to Phillimore's Marriages Jonathan was a widower and Anne a widow. They baptised two sons called William Calf at Fowey William on 4 Nov 1764 (no burial record found) and William on 12 Oct 1766. At the baptism of the second William, Jonathan was a roper. He later became a Salf Officer at Fowey and CRO has several documents such as properties leased to him at Fowey. I also have a copy of the will of Jonathan Calf, Salt Officer of Fowey from 1812 in which he leaves his estate to Jonathan Calf, who was probably his sole surviving child, his wife Anne having presumably pre-deceased him. I can find no burial record for either Jonathan or Anne. Any ideas as to the problems regarding Jonathan's age at the time of his first marriage to Mary Alexander at Gillingham would be greatly appreciated. Mary
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Post by myghaelangof on Aug 3, 2011 4:41:52 GMT -5
Hello Mary,
No personal interest in the Calf family but some thoughts on reading your last post:
Presumably Jonathan CALF moved to the docks around Medway working as a roper. Was he in the services, and did he get posted overseas after the marriage? Hence no children 1747-1755. The baptism dates of the later children suggests they were baptised close to birth. Maybe the family moved to another dockyard, ie Portsmouth.
Maybe, if Jonathan was only a young lad when they got married, he just wasnt ready for family? Could have been some sort of marriage of convenience, or the family committing the pair to each other? I'm sure someone will correct me here, but I think the legal ages for marrying back then were 14 for lads, 12 for lasses?
Where was Mary ALEXANDER from? Could they have returned to her parish for baptisms of children 1747-1755?
And what of Elizabeth MARKS? Where did she hail from? Maybe a clue there?
Just provoking some thought , hope it helps,
best wishes Mike, off to Cornwall again in 2 weeks.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Aug 3, 2011 7:36:26 GMT -5
The most logical solution is that Jonathan is not John. Seems to me an assumption has been made that John and Jonathan are the same name. But although they do have slightly similar meanings they are different and I have seen other families where both names appear. And although legal until (I think) at least into the latter half of the 19th Century it would be unusual in the extreme to find anyone outside Royalty or the Upper Classes being married at age 14. And at that age I should think any marriage would have been 'arranged'. William and Elizabeth baptised three sons as John (not Jonathan!) which tells me in a fairly direct way that when they named them John they actually meant John! It would be therefore most strange for the third of these sons to up and marry at a barely legal age and suddenly decide his name was Jonathan ............. no matter how keen his parents were that he be John! The naming of son Philip Hall Calf I think is the only potential link to the family of William and Elizabeth which means it is quite possible that he was not their son. If we begin with the possibility that Jonathan was indeed another son of William and Elizabeth then there are other things to consider. As I understand it there are baptisms for four known children - John (1723), Elizabeth (1726), John (1731) and John (1735) with all baptised at Fowey. William and Elizabeth were married in 1721 so the Their are obvious gaps where it is logical other children might have been. But whether baptisms are missing from the records or they were baptised elsewhere for the moment must remain unknown. If you look at those baptisms again in conjunction with the burial information it suggests to me that the children were baptised within a reasonable time after birth. Hmmmm - there is actually more to this than immediately meets the eye! IGI/FamilySearch records that the third John was born 3rd February 1735 whilst the OPC site indicates a baptism on that date with the information transcribed from the Bishops Transcripts. Whichever way you look at it the OPC transcription confirms that the date in the register was 3rd February 1735. And given that this is a Julian date then we need to look at it from a Gregorian Calendar point of view. Technically speaking John Calf was born/baptised 3rd February 1736 and that means that in November 1747 he would have still been nearly 3 months short of his 12th birthday!!!!!!Based on that it is totally impossible for John Calf (1735) and Jonathan Calf (married 1747) to have been the same person!! CT
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Post by marychown on Aug 3, 2011 7:42:47 GMT -5
Many thanks for getting back to me so soon on this one, Mike. I've also assumed that Jonathan Calf was working at the Royal Naval Dock Yards in Chatham during the time that he was living in Kent. I have no definite proof though that he was working in the Navy. I've wondered about a posting abroad or elsewhere in the UK where earlier children may have been born - but if there were any, they must have died in infancy. It had also crossed my mind that Jonathan may have been press ganged for a number of years and that could explain the absence of children being born for some nine years after marriage. I think a male between the ages of 15 and 55 with seafaring experience could be press ganged in the mid-eighteenth century.
Like you I understand that at that period of the eighteenth century it was legal for a boy to marry at 14 and girl at 12 as long as they had parental consent. So if that were the case, then Jonathan would have had to have been born in 1733 to have been married in late 1747. I believe that the Marriage Act was tightened up in 1753 to stop irregular practices.
As yet, I have not been able to find any suitable baptism record for Mary Alexander so I have no idea where she was from. I do not think that it was from the Fowey/Cornwall area.
John/Jonathan's mother Elizabeth Marks was baptised at Fowey on 15 April 1701 as the daughter of Nathan Marks, (a wostedcomer according to OBC records) and Jane Primier who were married at Fowey on 22 Dec 1681 - so I have so far found no clues there.
Hope you have a good time in Cornwall. We spent a week there in late June and were able to take part in Mazey Day at Penzance for the first time in ten years. The Golowan Festival is always really good fun.
Once again, many thanks for your input,
Kindest regards,
Mary
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Post by marychown on Aug 3, 2011 7:53:22 GMT -5
Thanks for your input CT. It seems that the identity of Jonathan Calf who married Mary Alexander in 1747 will continue to be a mystery. However the naming of his son Philip Hall Calf surely points to a close connection to the family of William Calf and his wife Elizabeth in Fowey, since their daughter Elizabeth married a Philip Halls and Jonathan Calf returned to live in Fowey. Hopefully, as more church records become available the matter will eventually be clarified.
All the best,
Mary
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Post by myghaelangof on Aug 4, 2011 10:02:15 GMT -5
Aplogies if I'm going over any old ground but on 10 minutes break from work have just searched TNA and CROCAT sites for Jonathan CALF (no variant spellings tried) and located the following: 1746 Navy Board documents re JC at Plymouth, roper 1767/1789 JC roper, and 1812 JC salt offiver, Will Some of these may give a clue, especially the relationships on the lease of 3 lives. I tend to agree with CT that John and Johnathan are 2 different persons. Question is: Where is Jonathon? Mike
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Aug 4, 2011 11:42:50 GMT -5
Mike - that reference to Jonathan Calf at Plymouth in 1746 is interesting. Perhaps some further investigation of Devon might be worthwhile for Mary to see if part of that gap might be filled. Not east to get information for Devon but it is there if you can find a way to access it.
Also interesting that a Jonathan Calf married Elizabeth Crispin at Kingsbridge, Dveon in 1786.
CT
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Post by marychown on Aug 4, 2011 14:29:28 GMT -5
Thanks CT and Mike for the further information - 1746 Navy Board documents. I knew from the baptism records of two of his sons named William at Fowey in 1764 and 1766 respectively that at this period Jonathan Calf was a rope maker and roper. I obtained a copy of the 1812 will of Jonathan Calf, Salt Officer of Fowey, and learned from it that he left his estate to Jonathan Calf, presumably his son - but it does not shed any light on any further relationships.
It may have been Jonathan Calf's son also named Jonathan Calf baptised 1757 who married Grace Haine at St. Martin on Looe Bay on 17 September 1781 (Family Search.org England Births and Christenings 1538-1975). It may also have been this same Jonathan Calf who married Elizabeth Crispin at Kingsbridge, Devon on 1 March 1786 and possibly it was he also who married a third time to Susanna Bartlett at Stoke Damerel on 15 October 1809. A burial for a Jonathan Calf aged 80 at Charles, Plymouth, Devon on 19 November 1834 (Parish Records Collection/Burial at Find My Past from Devon Burials data provided by Devon Family History Society) suggests that this may have been the Jonathan Calf baptised on 25 September 1757 at Gillingham, Kent as the age of 80 puts his year of birth at about 1754 i.e. within three years of the baptism date of Jonathan Calf baptised at Gillingham.
All the best,
Mary
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Post by myghaelangof on Aug 4, 2011 17:33:38 GMT -5
TNA Item reference ADM 106/1026/212 "Jonathan Calf, John Davis and Jacob Carthew, Ropemakers. Asking that their "R" is removed at Plymouth."
I have no idea what removing an 'R' means, but if anyone can access The National Archives easily there may be a clue? Could it be as simple as 'Rope' !!
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Post by marychown on Aug 5, 2011 3:14:51 GMT -5
Many thanks once again, Mike. I have also been able to discover the following information on-line: Held amongst Treffry family documents at CRO a mention in a lease agreement: RefNo Title
TF Treffry of Place RefNo TF/84 Title Release, house near the fish stalls, Fowey Date 8 Dec 1767 Format Manuscript Extent 1 piece Description Parties 1) Thomas Treffry of Place, esquire, to 2) Alexander Hoskings of Fowey, peruke-maker. House near the fish stalls in occupation of Jonathan Calf, roper. Release, lease for a year missing. Jonathan Calf is also named on a Federation of Old Cornwall Societies web page named 'Smugglers of Cornwall, Coastguards and Revenue Men' being listed under the Port of Fowey: smugglers.oldcornwall.org/salt_officers.htmAt Parish Records Collection-Burials at Find My Past from Cornwall Burials/Cornwall Family History Society I have found a Fowey burial by Curate Thomas Nankivel on 24 March 1805 for Jonathan Calf. I do not think that this can be Jonathan Calf, Salt Officer, because CRO has his will of 1812. So maybe it was his son Jonathan Calf who was buried in 1805. Therefore, he could not have been the Jonathan Calf marrying Susanna Bartlet in 1809 at Stoke Damerel. All the best, Mary
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Post by zibetha on Aug 5, 2011 17:39:11 GMT -5
Using the same brilliant ;D Googling skills that brought me to this board (wish I could remember how I do it! ) I found the following information re: South African Settlers at www.southafricansettlers.info (new website southafricansettlers.com) Jonathan Calf born 1788 in Plymouth, Devon, England Father: Jonathan Calf Naem of Spouse: widower, name of spouse not given Date of Death: 24 Sep 1855 age 67 Place of Death: Cape Town, Cape Notes: DN 3359/1855. One son, a major: Jonathan Calf AND Jonathan Calf born 1810 Devonshire, England Father: Jonathan Calf Mother Susanna Bartlett Name of Spouse: married twice, 2nd wife surviving Date of Death: 7 Mar 1866 age 56 Place of death: Cape Town Cape Notes: DN 2509/1866. Children: Susannah Elizabeth Johanna Elizabeth Margaret Maria James John Peter Stephen I guess those men weren't afraid to sail! Cousin Zib
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Aug 5, 2011 17:42:04 GMT -5
Hmmmm! Have you actually seen this Will, Mary? It is normal practice from what I have seen that when Indexes of Wills are produced or when organisations like CRO publish a reference to a Will in their catalogue the date recorded against the Wills are the DATES THE WILLS WERE PROVED. Before you convince yourself that the above statement is true I think you really need to get a look at that Will to find out WHEN IT WAS WRITTEN. It is not unusual for a Will not to be proved until years after it was written or years after the decease of the Testator. CT
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