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Post by snydly on Dec 5, 2009 21:27:21 GMT -5
Hi there;
I need help in tracking down information on my great aunt Florence Richards. Her parents are Edward Webb Richards(senior) and Annie (formerly Trevarthen)
What I know is she was born after 1901 but before 1916 as she was the middle sister to Edward Webb Richards and Alice Mary Richards.
I could not find her in the 1901 census information and I would expect her to be born around 1902 to 1912.
She did marry in 1930 or so to Horace Case. I would expect the marriage to be in St. Ives.
Unfortunately she died I think before World War 2.
Any help for her would be appreciated with the Birth, Marriage and Death dates.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 5, 2009 23:55:55 GMT -5
Florence Richards married William H Case September Qtr 1927 Penzance R.D. Vol 5c Page 470
With no second name/initial she would therefore most likely be one of the following:-
Florence Richards Penzance R.D. June Qtr 1902 Vol 5c Page 200
Florence Richards Penzance R.D. September Qtr 1902 Vol 5c Page 208
There are three others in the Penzance R.D. between 1900 and 1912 but each of these has a second name - Alexandra, Maud and Elizabeth - with the last born in 1904.
CT
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Post by newlyn on Dec 6, 2009 7:34:13 GMT -5
I have found some information which states that Florence Richards was born 1903. Edward Webb Richards born 1871 Annie Richards born 1877 Children: Edward Webb born 1899 John born 1911 Evelyn born 1906
All living in St Ives
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Post by snydly on Dec 10, 2009 5:35:48 GMT -5
I need help to clarify the children properly as their might be other children who died in infancy that even my mother does not know about.
Edward Webb Richards born Nov 5 1870, died March 7 1962 married Annie Trevarthen born June 9 1876, died May 17 1965
The children I have for them are: Edward Webb Richards born Sept(qtr) 1898, died Nov? 1957 (my grand father)(married Lena Toy 1931 in Shanghai) John Richards born Sept 10 1899, died 1899 (died in infancy) Florence Richards born 1902 or 1903, died 1930's (married William Horace Case in 1927) Alice Mary Richards born May 22, 1916, died Oct 19 1990 (never married)
I noticed you have another potential child named Evelyn ... can you give me any more information on her?
Thanks
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 10, 2009 7:47:45 GMT -5
Apart from Alice Mary whom you have just mentioned I have the following children:-
Edward Webb Richards Born 7th August 1898 St Ives Baptised 26th September 1898 St Ives (of 11 Bedford Rd, St Ives) (Ref. Transcript of St Ives Baptisms)
John Richards Born 6th August 1899 St Ives Baptised 10th September 1899 St Ives (of 11 Bedford Rd, St Ives) Died 1899 (Ref. Transcript of St Ives Baptisms)
Florence Richards Born 1902 (one of two born that year in the Penzance R.D.) (Ref. FreeBMD and 1911 Census)
Evelyn Richards Born c.1905 St Ives (Ref. 1911 Census age 5 - I have not been able to find her in FreeBMD)
John Richards Born 1911 St Ives (Ref. 1911 Census age 1 month)
In 1911 the family was living at 19 Bedford Road, St Ives.
CT
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Post by snydly on Dec 10, 2009 18:11:00 GMT -5
Thanks CT The oral history of all these tragedies in our family were not talked about by Alice Mary. Each time my mother asked about the past she used to get sneered at or told off by Alice Mary. Perhaps we now can understand the amount of tragedy these 2 surviving children went through during those years. Kind of breaks your heart thinking about it really. The tragedy of this side of the family continued on to my Grand father Edward Webb as well, as his death in 1957 was suspected a suicide by the note left before his death. This death occurred 2 to 3 months after my Mother married my Father in London in 1957. To think that 5 of the 6 children died before reaching a full age ... ugh!!
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 11, 2009 0:13:07 GMT -5
Happy to help Snydly. On a happier note I have your Richards family back to the marriage of John Richards and Mary Warren at St Ives 27th June 1825. I am reasonably confident of this and the following information. Unfortunately John Richards was deceased before the 1851 Census so it is difficult to positively identify him. His age in 1841 was recorded as 38 and indicates it was not rounded down like most adults. This would place his birth around 1802 and there is a John Richards baptised at St Ives in that year to parents Thomas and Grace. But I am not comfortable with this for a couple of reasons. Firstly - we do not know that he was actually born at St Ives, although it appears likely. Secondly - the first three sons of John and Mary were named John, John and then James with Thomas being the fourth son. James does not seem to appear in the Warren side so logically I would expect it to come from the Richards side of the family. Of course the name may have come from elsewhere but .... I can find no James baptised to Thomas and Grace, at least not at St Ives, and that makes me wonder just a little. So until a death/burial record can be found for John he will have to remain in limbo. On the Warren side I believe I have identified Mary and this is largely due to the naming of a daughter as Margaret Noall Richards. I believe Mary to have been baptised at St Ives 8th January 1804 to parents John and Ann. John Warren married Ann Uren, widow, 5th October 1802 at St Ives And I believe the following is Ann's first marriage:- Philip Uren, mariner, married Ann Noall 21st July 1899 at St Ives I have found only one child to this marriage - Philip in 1800. Ann Noall was then baptised at St Ives 1st December 1776 daughter of Peter Noall and Mary Harry Amongst Ann's siblings was a sister named Margaret after whom Margaret Noall Warren was possibly named. Margaret Noall Richards would then have been named for Mary Warren's sister of the same christian names. I am yet to satisfactorily identify Susan CARTER however as the information so far has been too abstract regarding her age and place of birth. CT
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Post by snydly on Dec 11, 2009 2:40:50 GMT -5
Thanks CT;
Alot of your information looks great.
Just one thing, I have for the 1841 census the following in my tree ... please try to see if this ties in correctly or not, I think we have different familes for this tie in on the tree:
Township of Breage, House Hendra John Richards age 35 Tin Miner Mary " age 30 John " age 12 Mary " age 10 Elizabeth " age 8 Richard " age 7 James " age 3
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 11, 2009 4:01:08 GMT -5
Snydly - that looks very much like the family of John and Mary Ann Richards who are at Camborne in 1851. Both were born Breage as were all children down to James. Another child, daughter Harriet, was born at Breage about 1844 and then Hannah born at Camborne about 1848. The only difference seems to be that, apart from Mary not being with the family, James is age 16 in 1851. But the Breage records show James son of John and Mary Ann Richards of Hendra baptised 28th May 1839 at Breage. There is no other James son of John and Mary recorded in the Breage records between 1830 and 1840 so I do suspect it is the same family. And their son John was also born at Breage. Your John, husband of Honor Branwell Carter was 'of St Ives' when he married and his birtplace is consistently recorded as St Ives in later Census records. From his age along with the fact his father was named as John in the marriage record it is more probable that he was:- John son of John and Mary Richards bp. 1st June 1827 at St Ives The parents are then John Richards and Mary Warren who married at St Ives 27th June 1825. For John at Hendra I should think it would be the following marriage:- John Richards married Mary Ann Harris 28th March 1829 at Breage I really think the St Ives family is the one you want. The one thing I have not yet been able to figure out is where the name 'Webb' came from. CT
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Post by londoner on Dec 11, 2009 4:47:56 GMT -5
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 11, 2009 4:58:07 GMT -5
Thanks Londoner I knew we had distussed Susan Carter at some time but could not remember which thread. I will have another look at this after I have finished installing some new hardware. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 11, 2009 6:24:27 GMT -5
Taking Londoner's advice and checking back through the thread we find the following from HeatherC:-
From this I have had a look for baptisms for Elizabeth Webb in the IGI and found an entry which I have also checked via the OPC site.
Elizth d/o Edward and Mary WEEB bp. 23rd April 1780 at Perranuthnoe
Edward Webb married Mary Jennings 12th May 1779 at Breage (both of Breage)
No sign of the name Honor Branwell anywhere yet - at least not where an obvious connection can be seen.
And also no sign of a likely baptism for Susan Carter around 1807.
Will continue looking.
CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 11, 2009 6:53:53 GMT -5
Another possibly interesting entry. Jeffery Carter bp. 29th June 1777 at Germoe son of Jeffery and SUSANNA Geoffrey Carter married Susanna Mollard 18th November 1767 at Germoe At least we have some information to suggest that the wife of Malachi Hingston 'may' have been the daughter of Jeffery and Elizabeth Carter. But that is all I can find at the moment.
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Post by snydly on Dec 21, 2009 3:31:42 GMT -5
Thanks again CT ...
I will load some of this information into my tree and see if it matches up with other people's research on Ancestry.co.uk
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Post by snydly on Mar 1, 2011 23:05:49 GMT -5
Could this be the death of John Richards we are looking for ?
Burials - Details of record ID 1082113: Parish: Ives, St. Date: 22-Jul 1849 Name: John RICHARDS Age: 47 Residence: St Ives Register notes: Transcriber Notes: Transcriber: Ian J Trewhella
And Birth of John Richards?
Baptisms - Details of record ID 1433969: Parish: Ives, St. Date: 28-Apr 1802 Name: John RICHARDS Sex: son Father: Thomas Mother: Grace Residence: Father's rank/profession: Register notes: Transcriber Notes: Transcriber: Ian J Trewhella
On my Ancestry travels this family has gotten into a royal Mess ... so I am starting over from the Mary Warren/John Richards marriage to see what the possibilities are.
1841 Census in Breage ... looks to be best fit for him Civil parish: Breage Hundred: Kerrier County/Island: Cornwall Country: England Street Address: Hendra
Occupation: Tin Miner Registration district: Helston Sub-registration district: Breage Household Members: Name Age John Richards 35 Mary Richards 30 John Richards 12 Mary Richards 10 Elizabeth Richards 8 Richard Richards 7 James Richards 3
My information from my Ancestry Entry:
Children (5) John Richards B: 1827 Mary Richards B: 1830 Elizabeth Richards B: 1832 Richard Richards B: 1833 James Richards B: 1837
John RichardsB:6 April 1806 in Breage, Cornwall, England Mary Warren B:abt 1808 in Cornwall, England
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