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Post by donne on Nov 25, 2009 4:52:35 GMT -5
Another of the Trewinnard documents (HA/5/51) I discovered at the Courtney Library was a deed of 'release and purchase' of a third part of the Manor of Trewinnard in 1657 from a SMITH and his wife to John ST AUBYN Esq. However, the bit I found most interesting was a separate indenture bound in with the rest of the deed which listed those tenements and their holders which were not part of the deal.
I was struck by the following listing for a holding described as 'Tremellyn and Tregose' said to be held by John DUNNE, Marten DUNNE and John DUNE the younger. Now, I know that Tremellyn was associated with this family because of the reference in Pascow DUN's will, and I've got a good idea of who John DUNNE, elder and younger, would be.
My question to the collective is where Marten DUNNE comes from? I can find no reference in the St Erth PRs of that date to a Marten. The earliest reference to a Marten DONN I have is as the father of Jone bap. 1 May 1658 in Gulval parish, but I have yet to confirm a link to the St Erth family, or find any further details.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 25, 2009 6:49:52 GMT -5
My records show the following entry from the St Erth PR Transcripts:- John son of Martin DONNE bp. 2nd November 1651 at St Erth Based on that I would suggest this would be your man. But it also brings in the question of 'John the younger'.  Your inference suggests the possibility (I think) that this might have been the son of the elder John but this baptism entry offers the possibility also that 'John the younger' might have been the son of Martin. Afraid I have no more than this but .... I must also say that this is the only child for Martin that I found in the St Erth PRs. CT |
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Post by white on Nov 25, 2009 9:43:28 GMT -5
Hi again Roger,
I have always placed Marten as a son of John (Bapt.25 feb.1598/9).So Marten would then be a grandson of Pascoe.
Unfortunately no bapt.found for Marten. However the only child I have for Marten is a John( bapt.2 nov.1651, St.Erth)
Of course my placement could be wrong.
Roy
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Post by donne on Nov 25, 2009 18:35:32 GMT -5
Thanks CT and Roy, I had overlooked the John, son of Marten baptism in St Erth which you pointed out.
My interpretation of the reference in the document to the holders of Tremellyn was that the first named, John DUNNE was the son of Pasco bap 1599. The second John, written John DUNE the younger, I thought could be the son of the first named, bap. in Paul 15 Mar 1626 (interestingly, his name is written in the document as DUNE, exactly as it appears in the IGI transcription of the Paul PR entry).
Marten could not be a further son of Pasco, since all his surviving children are mentioned in his will, so it is tempting to think that he is a son of John and a grandson of Pasco - but as you say, there is no baptism recorded to suggest this.
By the way, I discounted the idea that John the younger was a son of Martin. The recorded baptism of John son of Martin is in 1651, making him just 6 years of age at the date of the document, 1657. The names recorded are not, as I understand it, 'lives' but the actual holders of the tenements listed so one would expect them all to be mature persons.
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Post by pennsylvania on Apr 4, 2014 11:17:46 GMT -5
Ok folks new to all this but I have Marten as son of Pascoe b. 1633
From the Cornwall database...
Day Month 06-Jan
Year 1666/7
Parish Or Reg District Gulval
Forename Marten
Surname DON
Sex Son
Father Forename Paskow
hopefully I am correct and this will help someone
Deb
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Post by donne on Apr 4, 2014 13:26:49 GMT -5
Hi Deb, it's good to have your participation. I think most of us will have found the Gulval reference on the Cornwall OPC website relating to the baptism of a Martin DON in 1667. The point about my original posting is that the deed I found in the Courtney Library dating to 1657 seems to indicate an adult Marten DUNNE, predating of course the 1667 baptism - my question was, where did this Marten come from?
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Apr 5, 2014 1:30:28 GMT -5
CT to the rescue!!!  What about this from the Paul Parish Register - Martin sonne of Jo: Done was baptifed the 13th daie of September 1625After reading the previous posts I decided to have another check of the OPC database using a more 'open' search - 'mart d' - and found the above entry with the surname transcribed as DOUE. Londoner was the transcriber and she is excused in this case as the way the 'n' was written it does actually look like 'doue'. In actual fact the name could have been interpreted as DOUE, DONE or DOVE! Anyway, DONE, in my opinion, is most certainly correct and I think now the solution to the problem is found.  And although Paul is a little way from St Erth evidence suggests that this is the Martin of 1657 which in turn suggests that he may have been the eldest child of John Dunn and Mary Noye who married at St Erth 24th November 1624. The earliest child I have for this couple in my database to date is An baptised at St Erth in 1629. CT |
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Post by donne on Apr 5, 2014 2:57:39 GMT -5
Hi CT,
Thank you very much for that. I will check out the reference but I am persuaded that you have the correct interpretation, particularly since I have attributed the baptism of a first child John DUNE 15 Mar 1626 in Paul to the couple John DUNE and Mary NOYE (this date was sent to me by a fellow researcher and I don't have an independent verification from a primary source). If verified that would add weight to the Paul connection, although it is a puzzle as to what the family would be doing there since subsequent baptisms seem to be in St. Erth.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Apr 5, 2014 3:14:39 GMT -5
Hi Roger - consider the 1626 baptism of John confirmed - 'John sonne to Jo: Dune was Baptifed the 15th daie of March 1626
I will send you copies of the relevant pages from the Paul PR via email.
BTW - have you found marriage records for Martin and John??
CT
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Post by donne on Apr 5, 2014 6:00:33 GMT -5
Hi Ian
Thank you for the parish register images which I have received and perused - all the loose ends seem to tie up convincingly! As I mentioned in my reply to your email, I am surprised that they did not name the first-born son John, after the father, but the seniority does seem to be confirmed in the wording of the Courtney Library document which lists the holders of Tremellyn and Tregoose as 'John Dunne, Marten Dunne and Joh Dune (sic) the younger'.
I have no marriages for the two sons Martin and John, though speculatively I have attributed two baptisms to a marriage of Martin's. These baptisms are for John DONN 2 Nov 1651 in St Erth and Jone DONN 1 May 1658 in Gulval. I also thought that Martin was probably the Martyn DUN, yeoman, of Gulval, whose will (AP/D/661) was proved 26 Nov 1669 and is extracted in azazella's database - apparently the will consisted of admon plus inventory and the admon has not survived so the information is sparse.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Apr 5, 2014 11:12:02 GMT -5
That is about as far as I have managed to get as well so I guess have need to keep looking/waiting. I am sure something will turn up eventually that will help point us in the right direction. CT |
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Post by donne on Apr 5, 2014 14:13:31 GMT -5
The burial of Martin DUN in Gulval seems to be recorded on the Cornwall OPC site as 'Martinus DON buried 20 Sep 1663 (I don't know why it took 6 years to prove his will but they were troubled times). Now, the site also records on 6 Nov 1662 the burial of an Hellenora DON but the notes say 'vid.' which I'm guessing is short for vidua, meaning widow in Latin. So potentially we have the name of a wife of one of the DONs, though not Martin since he would have been still alive at the time. Since Hellenora is rather an unusual name I thought it would be worth looking back through Gulval baptisms but the closest I could come to was Ellenora NICCHOLL bap. 26 Jan 1617/8. Not sure where that gets me but it may be a place to start digging.
By the way, I've now had a look at the Gulval parish register images on the Family Search website. I see that there are no recorded marriages between April 1646 and November 1653, which maybe corresponds with the time of Commonwealth following the Civil War, when strange things sometimes happened to the system of parish records. A pity, because that's when we might expect to see marriages for Martin and John.
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Post by white on Apr 6, 2014 8:36:04 GMT -5
Ok folks new to all this but I have Marten as son of Pascoe b. 1633 From the Cornwall database... Day Month 06-Jan Year 1666/7 Parish Or Reg District Gulval Forename Marten Surname DON Sex Son Father Forename Paskow hopefully I am correct and this will help someone Deb Hi personal message sent RW |
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