Matthew Trewhella

[calswimmer]

Who is the Matthew Trewhella in 1841 in Phillack? He is married to Grace, is 60 years old, and has children William, John, and Catherine. I think I am close to identifying The Bawdens around him.

[Cornish Terrier]

Who is the Matthew Trewhella in 1841 in Phillack? He is married to Grace, is 60 years old, and has children William, John, and Catherine. I think I am close to identifying The Bawdens around him

An interesting, but easy, question to answer.

There was a Matthew Trewhella married to Grace UREN in 1836 but he and his family were at Ludgvan in 1841 and the names William and Catherine did not appear among their children.

He was related to the Matthew of this query but was also about 30 years younger.

The Matthew Trewhella at Phillack (of this query) was baptised at Towednack 14th March 1779 s/o William TREWHELLA and Ann (nee COCK) and was the brother of my 4xgt-grandfather.

Matthew married Martha DANIELL at Towednack 2nd August 1801.

He was buried at Phillack 26th March 1859 (age 80, of Riviere - a farm in Phillack Parish).

Martha was buried at Phillack 15th November 1853, age 72, fof Riviere.

Martha was baptised at St Ives 3rd October 1781 (IGI) d/o John and Margaret (nee STEVENS) DANIEL.

In 1841 there were three children of Matthew and Martha living at home.

These were, as mentioned in the query, William, John and Catherine.

There were seven further children of Matthew and Martha of whom two Eliza (1809-1809) and Martin (1818-1819) were deceased prior to the 1841 Census.

Of the remainder:-

Matthew (1802-1849) was married and living elsewhere
Martha (1804-?) was married to Samuel Michell of Towednack
Christopher (1813-1875) never married but was 'of Riviere Farm' when he died and left his Will.
James (1815-1884) married his cousin Ann TREWHELLA in 1840 and resided at St Erth.
Margaret (1823-?) married John HARVEY at Phillack in 1855.

Of the three children 'at home' in 1841:-

William (1807-1877) married Eliza Ninnes SAUNDRY at Madron in 1843 and resided at Trenerth Farm in Gwinear where he died.

John (1811-1883) married Jane CHINN in 1850 and resided at Treglissian (Treglistian?) Farm in Phillack where he died.

Catherine (1820-1897) married Samuel OULD at Phillack in 1848.

To my knowledge, so far, the BAWDEN people living nearby had nothing to do with this family and, having a quick look at the entries in the 1841 Census, I can see no tangible connection.

This does not mean, however, that it was not the case.

Another 'cousin' of Matthew Trewhella (without racking the brain too much - I think was a first cousin) was Martin TREWHEELA.

(Please ignore the spelling of the surname in some of these entries as I have produced them as they appeared in the Parish Registers).

This Martin TREWHEELA marred Margaret THOMAS at Towednack in 1783.

Their daughter Margaret married Edward BAWDEN at Ludgvan 15th May 1813 and had, to my knowledge, seven children.

Edward BAWDEN was, I understand, baptised at Phillack 8th September 1792 s/o Edward BAWDEN and Elizabeth (nee COCK).

Edward Bawden was, at the time of his marriage, 'of Gwinear'.

Hope this helps.

Look forward to further input and conversation on this family and hope I may be able to help further.

[calswimmer]

Thank you for all this. You're right--it was Martha. I don't know where Grace came from when I was writing that. Well, now I do see that there was a Grace married to a Matthew born about the same time of Towednack. I must have confused them.
Edward Bawden is 10 years old when residing in the family of Matthew Trewhella, so due to his age I thought he might be related to one of them.

[Cornish Terrier]

No problem but there are some easily confusing scenarios when it comes to 'my family'.

But the Edward Bawden to which you refer (residing with Matthew and Martha Trewhella in 1841) was actually one of the servants.

To my current knowledge there is no relationship but ....

However - please let me know of your BAWDEN connections and give me some clues and I will try and track down some more information for you.

Never know when it may connect up with other parts of my family history.

Must to sleep and then work.

[zibetha]

While attempting to sort out my Harvey relatives, an online inquiry I made led me back here to this thread. Looks like its been quiet for awhile, but, I thought I'd atttempt to toss my family into the mix to link up all the parties in question.

My 4th great-grandmother, Anne Trewhela (daughter of Thomas T of Crowan & Martha Blewitt) married William Harvey of Gwinear in 1806.

1. In Mar 1852, their daughter, Ann Harvey, married William Stevens. Witnesses were Margaret Trewhella and Samuel Auld.

2. In Oct 1852, their son, Martin, married Emma Bawden, daughter of Edward Bawden and Margaret Trewhella (daughter of Martin T & Margaret Thomas.) At 1861 census, Edward is a widower visiting Emma & Martin. Emma had a brother Edward also-- but I think he was born in 1817, so he wouldn't have been 10 in 1841??

3. Lastly, in 1855, son John Harvey married Margaret Trewhella, residence Riviere, the daughter of Matthew T & Martha Daniels, who I believe was the witness to marriage #1 along with her sister Catherine's husband.

I am surprised to turn up so many Towednack Trewhellas.

Zibetha

P.S. A question: any idea who the "Christ Harvey" referenced in Thomas Trewhella's will might have been?

[Cornish Terrier]

Zibetha - somehow I almost missed this post altogether!

I cannot answer your question about Christopher Harvey but he is in the Will as being the 'occupier' of the house being left to one of Thomas Trewhella's children.

It may be that he was nothing more than that - a tenant.

Now, my one big concern with this Harvey family is with son John.

I have now linked the husband of Margaret Trewhella as a son of William and Ann (nee Trewhella) Harvey but there is something not quite right about it all.

I had noted a long time back that I suspected this was the right family but ......

The baptisms I have found for children of William and Ann (or Hannah) include:-

John son of William and Hannah bp. 1st October 1815 Gwinear
John son of William and Hannah bp. 31st May 1818 Gwinear

I can find no burial for the first and there is nothing that I can find in the baptismal records to suggest one was a private and the other a public baptism.

The other problem here is that the husband of Margaret Trewhella is consistently recorded with an age that equates to a birth around 1815 or 1816.
That, of course, suggests that he was the son baptised in 1815 but it leaves us with the problem again of that second baptism.

Do you have any ideas or have you found something that I have not?

CT

[zibetha]

John is now the only sibling for whom I have no baptism date. Used to be about 50/50. I have him as slightly older than his sister Jane, younger than Ann. Est DOB at 1816.

His father William and brother William were both farmers/innkeepers/butchers. (Bet no veggie pasties were served at those inns). I have never seen any records for "my" Anne as Hannah, only "Ann" or "Anne"--- I think William and Hannah with the 2 sons John are another family.

Wish I had a treasure trunk of unpublished records, but I do not.

[Cornish Terrier]

I think William and Hannah with the 2 sons John are another family.

Right now I am going to agree and disagree and say yes and no! ;D

I now have reason to think that the earlier John (1815) belongs but the other one does not.

What I need to find is another marriage, and preferably more children, for another William and Ann/Hannah.

It is interesting to note that the occupation of William when John was baptised in 1815 was 'husbandry' yet when the later John was baptised in 1818 William was recorded as a 'miner'.

Husbandry equates to farming so, given no burial can be found for the earlier John, I am inclined to think we have two separate families.

That 'our' Ann was recorded as Hannah is not so unusual and this seems the only explanation at the moment that would solve the problem.

If you check the 1851 Census I think the above makes even more sense.

'Our' John was living at home with his mother at Crowan but there are TWO more John Harvey's in the 1851 Census who were both age 32, both born at Gwinear and both married.

One will have been the son of John and Rebecca baptised in 1819.

But the other MUST BE the son of William and Hannah baptised in 1818 as these are the only John Harvey's recorded at Gwinear around the right time.

So off for some more searching to see if I can find the pieces that will cement this scenario together.

CT

[Cornish Terrier]

Things are looking up methinks!

John son of John Harvey married Elizabeth daughter of William Clark 25th December 1842 at Gwinear

This is the son of John Harvey and Rebecca Glasson who was baptised 8th August 1819 at Gwinear.

But then we come to John Harvey age 32 (born Gwinear) with wife Hannah at Gwinear in 1851.

John son of WILLIAM Harvey married Hannah Heitner (OPC has Huther) 3rd November 1839 at Gwinear

This must be the John son of William and Hannah baptised 31st May 1818 at Gwinear and it is almost certain proof that there is another family involved.

UNLESS - we have another case of TWO sons of the same name to William and Ann!

Next step is to see if I can find more children and another marriage for William and Hannah.

BTW - the surname of Hannah is quite an odd one as it appears here (Heitner or Huther) so I checked the image on FreeBMD.
That image is absolutely atrocious and there is no way really that the name can be deciphered accurately.
There is, however, another means to access an image for this event and that is through Ancestry.
That image is quite clear and the name as recorded (typed index) is HEITHER.

I believe that will be a bastardisation of the neme HEATHER which can be found in the Gwinear area.

CT

[londoner]

Apr 1, 2011 4:36:33 GMT -5 Cornish Terrier said:

I think William and Hannah with the 2 sons John are another family.

Husbandry equates to farming so, given no burial can be found for the earlier John, I am inclined to think we have two separate families.



CT

Farming and mining are not mutually exclusive. I have seen occupations change over time - possibly because a seam was found near the farmer's land and he dug a shaft just in case it extended and he could get a share, or possibly just to supplement income.

[Cornish Terrier]

Quite right - however records for all other children of William and Ann (1813 onwards) show that he was consistently a farmer.

I know that it was not unusual for a 'one off' change but in this case I do not think it the case.

In 1851 we have three John Harveys who had been born at Gwinear and whose ages were 34, 32 and 32.

John son of William and Ann (nee Trewhella) was unmarried and living at home at Crowan with his mother and siblings.
John son of John was with wife Elizabeth at Gwinear.
John son of 'the other' William and Hannah was at Gwinear with his wife Hannah. (Hannah was buried in 1852 and John remarried prior to 1861).

Everything suggests either:-
1. there were two couples named William and Hannah Harvey
2. William and Ann had two sons named John who both survived and married.

Either way it seems inescapable that Ann Trewhella was recorded as Hannah in 1815.

CT