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Post by myghaelangof on Nov 2, 2009 10:09:14 GMT -5
I'm with you on that one Tony. For me the hunt is all about the social history.
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Post by Deleted on Nov 2, 2009 13:24:16 GMT -5
Through some great individuals (on this site) I am able to go back to 1489 on my paternal grandmothers side. I have a copy of wills and probate information that help support the evidence. On my paternal grandfathers side, I should be content with the 1735 time frame, but are any of us satisfied with feeding our passion?
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Post by Mal on Nov 2, 2009 15:08:44 GMT -5
Good reply.... I always say to myself, I'll be happy if I get this far back and all that, but then that insatiable curiosity grabs me, and sometimes it pays off!!!!
I also agree with An Gof, I love it when you get those extra bits of information. I have at least one who was involved in witch trial, Quakers and a few other bits that suddenly make the people from all those hundreds of years ago very "alive" again. I have also learnt a lot about Cornwall too, things I never did learn at school.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 8, 2013 16:43:40 GMT -5
I am happy that I can go back to my great X13th grandfather Henry Angwin (1490-1522). But what really excited me is when I found information on Martin Angwins wife Cicely Lanyon ... I think I found her X5th great grandfather Roger de Linyeine who may have married Agnes Beauchamp. I think I can tie her into the Beauchamp line that were related to William I. Then again 90% of all the Cornish can ... Like the others, I am interested in HOW they lived and what is fact from fiction (Hollywood) about the medieval times. I even have begun to take lessons in Kensa Kernewek. I need to go back to Cornwall again ... someday.
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Post by trencrom on Aug 9, 2013 4:22:08 GMT -5
I am happy that I can go back to my great X13th grandfather Henry Angwin (1490-1522). But what really excited me is when I found information on Martin Angwins wife Cicely Lanyon ... I think I found her X5th great grandfather Roger de Linyeine who may have married Agnes Beauchamp. I think I can tie her into the Beauchamp line that were related to William I. Then again 90% of all the Cornish can ... What is your source for Roger marrying Agnes Beauchamp? What Beauchamps were related to the Conqueror?
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2013 13:21:41 GMT -5
My initial source was the Family Tree of Robin Hichens of Cambridge. According to the Tree Agnes Beauchamp (abt: 1180-1215) married Roger De Linyeine. They had a son John b. abt 1200 Lanyon, Cornwall. By back tracing I came to my Cicley Lanyon who married Martin Angwin. I then did a check of other sites, to confirm this.
I was sidetracked a couple times (there are many Agne's) but it appears a Family of Beauchamps from Binnerton, Cornwall was the one where my Agnes came from. LDS Ancestral Files was another source to confirm basic time periods, marriages and names. Another source confirming this was found in a Lanyon Family Tree on Geni. One path led to Pepin of Italy and the other ended in Binnerton (I think this is more likely).
Now about William and the Beauchamps. Hugh de Beauchamp was a companion to Wm. and was granted lands and titles in Warwick. By checking Sir Thomas Beecham's family I found a connection to a De Beaumont, and further investigating found the same relationship to a De Beauchamp. I am sceptical of both, but it was interesting to read a sentence where Hugh, who is sometimes named as Robert, may have been descended from the Malcolm Gillocallum who is claimed as ancestor of the Campbells and his wife who was 'heiress of Beauchamp 'Campus bellus' and niece of William the Conqueror'. He is also thought to be the son of Walter son of Hugh who was born in Normandy in about 975.
There is nothing in the Binnerton line of Beauchamp that would indicate this, but I thought it was interesting. I think the Binnerton Beauchamps are related to the Warwick Beauchamps, but I am not pursuing this relationship.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Aug 9, 2013 19:01:40 GMT -5
You are kidding I hope? Sorry but I thought April 1st was past and not due again for another seven and half months!
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Post by Deleted on Aug 9, 2013 19:45:22 GMT -5
Oh, come-on .... they are full of misleading information and will make you believe King George is you great uncle ... but they have been correct on a lot of my family, with dates, etc. This confirmed with the Family Bible. I would NEVER use them for a source unless I could confirm it with two others. Then and only then would I think it is possible. But I understand what you are saying.
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Post by Tonkin on Aug 11, 2013 5:45:17 GMT -5
I've come across postings on other sites where people claim they have traced their family lines back BC. I kid you not. I'm having trouble going back to 1700. Roy ... from Down Under.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 11, 2013 16:09:06 GMT -5
Sounds like the lady I met who was a member of the Daughters of the American Revolution, family came over on the Mayflower, and could trace her family back 95 generations. Of course if I stretch some "internet rubbish", I can make an argument for a relationship to Charlemagne, but to reality and how to find out when the family migrated to Cornwall from Devon ... it is an asumption since the name orginated in Devon abt 1066.
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Post by trencrom on Aug 12, 2013 3:59:04 GMT -5
My initial source was the Family Tree of Robin Hichens of Cambridge. According to the Tree Agnes Beauchamp (abt: 1180-1215) married Roger De Linyeine. They had a son John b. abt 1200 Lanyon, Cornwall. By back tracing I came to my Cicley Lanyon who married Martin Angwin. I then did a check of other sites, to confirm this. I was sidetracked a couple times (there are many Agne's) but it appears a Family of Beauchamps from Binnerton, Cornwall was the one where my Agnes came from. LDS Ancestral Files was another source to confirm basic time periods, marriages and names. Another source confirming this was found in a Lanyon Family Tree on Geni. One path led to Pepin of Italy and the other ended in Binnerton (I think this is more likely). Now about William and the Beauchamps. Hugh de Beauchamp was a companion to Wm. and was granted lands and titles in Warwick. By checking Sir Thomas Beecham's family I found a connection to a De Beaumont, and further investigating found the same relationship to a De Beauchamp. I am sceptical of both, but it was interesting to read a sentence where Hugh, who is sometimes named as Robert, may have been descended from the Malcolm Gillocallum who is claimed as ancestor of the Campbells and his wife who was 'heiress of Beauchamp 'Campus bellus' and niece of William the Conqueror'. He is also thought to be the son of Walter son of Hugh who was born in Normandy in about 975. There is nothing in the Binnerton line of Beauchamp that would indicate this, but I thought it was interesting. I think the Binnerton Beauchamps are related to the Warwick Beauchamps, but I am not pursuing this relationship. Cousin Jack, thanks for your response. I have researched the Binnerton Beauchamps and know of no connection to the Beauchamps who were earls of Warwick. There MAY be a connection to another Beauchamp family that you have not mentioned, namely that of Hatch in Somerset. This possibility is because the "Binnertons" used the same coat of arms as the "Hatches". However I doubt very much that the Beauchamps had any close family connection to the Conqueror, whose family is well known. As far as the Lanyons go, i am researching these at present but am not aware of any Lanyon-Beauchamp marriage in the period that we are talking about, or of a descent for the family from Charlemagne's son Pepin or Pippin, king of Italy.
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Post by Deleted on Aug 20, 2013 20:14:09 GMT -5
I keep finding things, but as usual they are not in my primary search. Yet this may help: In 1215 in the Curia Regis Rolls, Agnes the wife of Roger de Linyeine pleaded for a third part of two acres of land on Lanion (in Cornwall) which she claimed as a dowry on Hugh de Bello Campo. I asume the 'Kings Court' Rolls are correct. I think Agnes was the daughter or at least the ward of Hugh. I'm fairly certain the dowry always had a paternal connection, because in the Middle Ages to my knowledge, women did not own property. Try: www.zikzak.net/~loiss/tree/index.html#INTRO ... go to surnames and find Beauchamp ... click on Agnes and go backward from there ... how much fact is in the 'Tree' I can't say, but I it may be a lead! Don't bother with Pepin ... if you get to Stephen de Beauchamp (1172-1239) you will end up somewhere in the 800's with Herbert I of Vermandois. He is supposed to be the son of Pepin Quentin Comte de Vermandois, grandson of Pepin I of the Carolingian dynasty. Too far back for me and too many questions unanswered.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Aug 21, 2013 4:10:58 GMT -5
There is a lot of distance between 1215 and 1700!!! And registers did not begin until 1538!!! AND - not all areas began using them in 1538!!! AND - many of the earliest ones do not survive!!! Do you have personally researched documentary evidence of your claims? Or has good old LDS come to the rescue again.
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Post by trencrom on Aug 23, 2013 3:28:18 GMT -5
I keep finding things, but as usual they are not in my primary search. Yet this may help: In 1215 in the Curia Regis Rolls, Agnes the wife of Roger de Linyeine pleaded for a third part of two acres of land on Lanion (in Cornwall) which she claimed as a dowry on Hugh de Bello Campo. I asume the 'Kings Court' Rolls are correct. I think Agnes was the daughter or at least the ward of Hugh. I'm fairly certain the dowry always had a paternal connection, because in the Middle Ages to my knowledge, women did not own property. Try: www.zikzak.net/~loiss/tree/index.html#INTRO ... go to surnames and find Beauchamp ... click on Agnes and go backward from there ... how much fact is in the 'Tree' I can't say, but I it may be a lead! Don't bother with Pepin ... if you get to Stephen de Beauchamp (1172-1239) you will end up somewhere in the 800's with Herbert I of Vermandois. He is supposed to be the son of Pepin Quentin Comte de Vermandois, grandson of Pepin I of the Carolingian dynasty. Too far back for me and too many questions unanswered. Cousin Jack, thanks for the response. Where did you find the information on the Curia Regis roll? And is it certain that the plea described relates to a dowry, rather than to dower? The reference to "the third part" sounds as if it might be the latter instead. I had a look at the website you cited, but found no information on the forebears of Agnes. The counts of Vermandois were indeed descended form the Carolingians, but Pepin 'the first" was a forebear of Charlemagne, not grandfather of Herbert. I can give you more details if you like. I think the question here though is rather whether there is any descent from the Vermandois to the Cornish (my emphasis) Beauchamps. I am not aware of any evidence for such a descent. Regards Trencrom
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Post by Tonkin on Aug 23, 2013 3:50:47 GMT -5
Good point CT. How do you connect family lines when there are no records to work with? Roy ... from Down Under.
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