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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 15, 2008 21:31:33 GMT -5
An addition to my last. I have two different items of documentation that suggest the wife of John Trewheeler. This would the man known as John Simon Trewheler who took his family to Russia in about 1818. Each suggest that his wife may have been a Miss SNOW which is quite interesting. I do know that her name was ANN and had suspected that her maiden name may have been COULTER given the 1813 baptism of son John Coulter Trewheellar at Woolwich, Kent. My initial thoughts when reading that her name could have been SNOW were that this was a mistaken identity and in fact referred to the mother of John himself. John was baptised at St Gluvias in 1786 and his mother's maiden name was Martha SNOW. I still think it likely that the reference is actually to her - but there is still also the possibility that Ann was also of that family. One of the documents I have is part of a study of British artisans who went to Russia to lend their expertise. This document indicates that the SNOW family (particular reference to a George SNOW) had been in Russia for quite some time and that this George had made himself know around the English Clubs of the time. It is interesting that there are records for only 10 baptisms for the name SNOW at St Gluvias although there are 214 baptism entries (with the usual many duplicates) recorded in IGI. The only Martha I could find who could possibly have married Richard TREWHEELLAR in 1786 was baptised at St Gluvias 9th December 1764 and was the daughter of Abraham and Martha. Her mother, according to IGI, was Martha KENT and the KENT name is used as a second christian name in the family. However, I cannot find a marriage for Abraham and martha and nor can I find a baptism for an Abraham who might have been her husband. So - was this family part of that group in Russia? I have also failed to find a marriage for John TREWHEELLAR and Ann. Is it possible that John had been to Russia previously and perhaps married there? But even IF Ann were of the SNOW family - the name of COULTER appearing in the family requires explanation. Somewhat of a dilemma I am afraid!
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Post by nzjohn1 on Nov 16, 2008 2:27:09 GMT -5
Hi
Whew, javascript:add("%20:o") what a story - it will take some time for me to assimilate all.
Meanwhile, am still trying to eliminate all possible London Trewheellers.
1881 census RG11/27 p3 Ann M Trewhella 48 widow, b. London and visitor to Geo Forman family at 1 Upper Phillimire Place Kensington, and her daughter Annie F ?I. 28 unmar. born Turin, Italy
also in 1871 census RG10/3078 p 35
Who was the husband/father - occ. railway engineer?
Cheers
NZjohn1
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Nov 16, 2008 3:33:23 GMT -5
Ahhh! (says he relaxing) - a nice easy one for me to answer for a change. Anna Maria TREWHELLA (nee THRUPP) born London about 1832 and died 8th July 1894 in Rome. Her husband was John TREWHELLA who was born at Ludgvan 8th March 1818 and baptised there 22nd May 1818. John died at Sorrento, Itali 10th July 1818 and is buried in the British Cemetery at Naples. John and Anna Maria married on the 23rd June 1851 at King's Norton. John had a younger brother Robert who was born at Ludgvan 13th May 1830 and baptised 30th May that year. John died at Catania, Sicily 6th February 1909. John married Kate Lucy THRUPP, sister to Anna Maria, at Legmorn, Italy, 2nd January 1862. They were sons of Robert and Mary (nee REPPER) TREWHELLA of Ludgvan and are connected way back into my own line. John and Robert were Railway Contractors and were responsible for lines such as that around Mt Etna and another major one near Palermo. Story has it that their family was 'ripped off' by Mussolini. I can tell you more about them if you wish. I don't know if there was any family connection with George Forman but now that you have asked about the family I will have a quick look around. I do need to know a little more about the THRUPP family for my records so ..... Regarding the HUGHES family - I have to say that I was extremely pleased with myself at finding those links. That sort of discovery makes all the hours of research and hard work all the more worthwhile. But if we could only track down the marriage of John and Ann ..... Enjoy - and please keep throwing queries at me. With any luck you will prompt another search that will turn up more long sought answers. CT
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Post by nzjohn1 on Dec 29, 2008 4:14:17 GMT -5
Hi,
More on Thomas Trewheellar, ?lighterman of London?
On 15 May 1857 he was the 1st Officer of the "ZINGARI" which plied around NZ ports. However, the Zingari's contract with the NZ Govt finished a few weeks later and in June he became Commander of the "Tasmanian Maid" which came from London in the latter half of 1856 and was in Melbourne for a few weeks before being sold to NZ interests.
Trewheellar may have come out from England on the Zingari and then was based in Sydney, before being contracted to NZ, and returned there after the contract. Thomas went to Sydney in 1885 and died there.
Is there any way of checking for the original crew list of the Zingari or any subsequent one in Australia?
Cheers
NZJohn1
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 29, 2008 5:03:52 GMT -5
More interesting information. I am not sure about crew lists for vessels such as the 'Zingari' but I will see what I can find on the PRO Websites. What type of vessel was she - do you know? You see we might be working on a rather tight time-line here - depending on just when the 'Zingari' arrived. I guess you have a copy of his marriage certificate? Married at Nelson 14th November 1856 'at the home of Thomas Trewheellar'. That suggests he had been there for at least a while but gives no clue as to just how long. And what of Elizabeth JOHNS - do we have any knowledge of when she came out from England? Let me see if I can find anything useful from the PRO.
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 29, 2008 5:22:36 GMT -5
You 'may' find this interesting:- www.brandis.com.au/genealogy/readers/age009.htmlExtract from the Age newspaper October 17, 1854 Zingari Monday 30th October, 1854. The new and fast-sailing Wooden Screw Steamer ZINGARI - to the Trading Community of Victoria, New South Wales, Adelaide, Van Diemen's Land &c, also the various companies now being formed for promoting Steam Communication. WM TENNANT and company have received instruction from Messrs. J. B. Were, Kent and Co. to sell by public auction at their rooms Collins Street, West on Monday, 30th instant at 12 o'clock, the Wooden Screw Steamer ZINGARI, 147 tons burthen and 60 horse power. This superior and first class boat was built in London in 1852, of the best English oak, diagonal fastened, being traced together with strong iron straps. Scantling of oak and rock elm. She is brig rigged - has raised quarterdeck, 50 feet in length and superbly fitted up for the accommodation of 26 first class passenger. She has also a round-house on deck, 34 feet long, comprising officer's berths, &c., including cooking galley, &c. Her engines are in first-rate working order, were made by the celebrated makers, Boulton and Walsh, are upon the low-pressure principle, working up to 60 horse power nominal. Number of revolutions, 56 to 66 per minute. Her boilers are in good repair, and constructed to bear a pressure of steam 10 to the inch. The consumption of fuel is very small being 6.25 cwt., per hour working full speed. The coal bunkers are capable of storing 50 tons of coal, and so constructed as to defend the engine and boiler from the effects of shot. In the engine-room is erected a donkey engine for pumping out water, and for a supply to wash decks with &c. This superior steamer is well supplied with general tackle, boats, and every requisite, titled to proceed to sea at once. She has iron water-tanks capable of holding about 7 tons of water. Her speed in ordinary weather under steam only is 14 knots per hour. The auctioneers would invite the marine mercantile community and steam navigation companies to inspect this favourite vessel, feeding papers added that they offer no comment upon the capabilities as a steamer well suited to the present wants of the colony. Terms very liberal, declared at Sale REF: email to AUSTRALIA-L@rootsweb.com by Lee Power on 9 June 1998 "The original source is the first Age Newspaper in Victoria - but as the document is rather fragile, I will not be accessing it for individual lookups - thought instead I would transcribe all I could onto the net for all to read." source the Age Newspaper of Tuesday Oct 17,1854 ** Found it by doing a Google Search using 'Zingari' as the search term. ** You might also like to have a look at this one:- mariners.records.nsw.gov.au/1859/01/051zin.htmIt gives a list of crew and passengers on the Zingari 19th January 1859 on a voyage from Melbourne to Sydney. A bit late for what we want but interesting all the same. I am going to try a couple of other searches now so will post or email any further interesting items I might find. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 29, 2008 5:39:26 GMT -5
Not having much luck with 'Zingari' except that she was quite active plying the Melbourne-Sydney route through the first half of 1859. No luck at all with 'Tasmanian Maid' but I did find something else of minor interest. mariners.records.nsw.gov.au/1888/07/010rot.htmROTOMAHANA STEAMSHIP OF SYDNEY, CAREY MASTER, BURTHEN 864 TONS FROM THE PORT OF RUSSELL, NZ TO SYDNEY, NEW SOUTH WALES, 2ND JULY 1888 This link gives a full list of Passengers and Crew and includes Mr, Mrs and Miss TREWHEELLER travelling in Saloon Class. I would suggest this was most likely Thomas with second wife Jessie and youngest daughter Nellie Atalina. Still looking. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 29, 2008 6:18:31 GMT -5
From my earlier note we now know that the 'Zingari' was built in London in 1852 and appears to have arrived in Victoria in 1854. Your own initial note suggests she was contracted to the NZ trade up until June 1857 when the contract ended. What we do not know yet is when that contract began. The State Records NSW site shows records of the 'Zingari' arriving in Sydney only thirteen times from 3rd December 1858 until 15th June 1859. (As far as I can tell the indexing is complete but I cannot guarantee it.) Another point to keep in mind is that we have not yet found Thomas TREWHEELLAR in the 1841 or 1851 Census in England so he may well have been anywhere! Will have a look at the Victorian Public Records Office shortly and see what I might find there. CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 29, 2008 7:36:16 GMT -5
The 'Zingari' left Melbourne for Nelson in November 1854. The next record of her departing Melbourne was November 1858 bound for Sydney which ties in with my previous note regarding arrivals in that Port. Thomas Trewheellar was not aboard. The ship arrived in Melbourne from Britain in June 1854. She arrived in Melbourne from New Zealand in July 1857. Once again, no sign of Thomas - in fact there are only 30 names inclusive for both arrival dates. (17 in 1854 and 13 in 1857) Hmmm - this would appear to be passengers only and I can so far find nothing to indicate availabilty of Crew Lists. And there is absolutely no sign of the 'Tasmanian Maid'. It looks very much like Thomas had nothing to do with the 'Zingari' until after she arrived in New Zealand in 1854 so we still need to keep searching for him. Have now tried searching New Zealand Shipping/Passenger List sites but still nothing found. Will have to leave it for now and maybe consider other options. CT
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Post by nzjohn1 on Dec 30, 2008 0:04:28 GMT -5
Hi CT & all,
Zingari left Melbourne (Nov. 1854) with its owner Maxwell Bury, his wife and 57 passengers (I have the names). What are the 17 names in your list? (Bury, a marine engineer, had the Zingari for at least a year before marriage and probably sailed in it). She arrived in Nelson 13/12/1854. Commander Millton was Captain of the Zingari for all of its time in NZ. As Bury & friends commissioned the building of the boat she seems not to have been auctioned in Melbourne (unless he bought it back). He settled in Nelson and was the agent for the purchase of the Tasmanian Maid in Melbourne in 1857 by the Nelson Coast Steam Association. He was also possibly a shareholder in the prior company, the Nelson Coast Steam Navigation Coy., and may have been involved in what became the Nelson and Marlborough Steam Navigation Coy. James Trewheelar was involved with the Tasmanian Maid right from the start, as Captain Wood who brought the vessel to NZ seems to have taken another vessel and may have returned to Melbourne. The contract (as a subsidy) for the Zingari seems to be also nearly from the start as an inter-provincial steamer doing a regular approix monthly curcuit Manukau-New Plymouth (if weather suitable)-Wellington-Nelson-Lyttelton and Port Otago, though the latter lapsed as the Otago govt seemingly did not pay their share. Shae may have paid two visits to Melbourne in the early years. She was out of action at least twice through grounding at Nelson and Manukau. Thomas Trewheellar was First Officer at the time of the second grounding (I have yet to check court records for the first but I know the Officers were interviewed). The 2nd grounding was on 13 May 1857, after the date (1st) that the Govt. contract lapsed. The Tasmanian Maid arrived in Nelson in June and Thomas was probably the Commander on its trial on the 23rd June, he was the Captain on seral subsequent voyages until August when the Captaincy was taken over by Commander Whitwell who remained in that position until the second wrecking of the Tasmanian Maid. The Tasmanian Maid did a cuicuit Nelson-Motueka-Collingwood-Wairau and sometimes to Wellington. The records are very messy and there are many misinterpretations of what happened. I believe many of the data presently on web sites is misleading if not downright incorrect. But those do not concern Thomas. His first child was born in Nov. 1857 and he formed a business of lighterman and custom-house agent on the wharf at Nelson (settled down as it were). He also bought and sold property, perhaps to finance his business(es). His actions after the sale of the business in 1861 seem incomprehensible. He became a partner in the bakery which he left after a two years and then left Nelson to establish his own bakery in Hamilton. BUT, he then bought (or leased) another small boat and transported goods from Wellington to Nelson, yet gave that up and returned to Hamilton by 1869. As you know his wife died, he remarried and went to Sydney!!! I have a sneaking suspicion that he fell out with his relations over religion - he and they all had strong non-conformist (Wesleyan-Baptist-Methodist etc) views (and that goes back at least two generations!!!!!! ? family myth?).
The Zingari left Sydney for Hong Kong sometome late 1859 or early 1860
more later - got to go to a New Year party and it is too hot - I might have to crawl home from next door. Best wishes for your New Year.
Cheers
NZJohn1
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 30, 2008 3:36:16 GMT -5
Thankyou my Trans-Tasman friend for this latest. Seems to be a bit of a picture building around old Thomas but I wish we could just find those few vital records we seek. A question - twice now (I think) and certainly in your latest the name 'James TREWHEELER' has entered this and I wonder if that is a misprint or, in fact, it is yet another 'person of interest'. Another question - Are you NZer's getting a little forward or are our Calenders all wrong over here. By my reckoning it is now December 30th so New Year's Eve should be tomorrow night! ;D Or are you just having a 'double dip'! ;D Make sure you have sturdy knee-pads for the crawl home! Oh - and don't forget the 6-pack for the trip. ;D Have a great one - CT
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 30, 2008 4:39:22 GMT -5
My apologies - I neglected to answer your query regarding the names of passengers on the 1854 voyage of the 'Zingari' from Melbourne to Nelson. And you have caught me with an error. I must have been tired but there are in fact 152 names listed for the two voyages and it would appear I have only quoted numbers for the first page! proarchives.imagineering.com.au/index_search.asp?searchid=42If you go to the above URL it should bring you directly to the search page. Simply enter the ship's name - Zingari - and click enter and you should be presented with the complete list. It will be seven page so you will need to click on the number for each page to view all passengers. CT
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Post by nzjohn1 on Dec 31, 2008 0:34:32 GMT -5
Hi CT,
Safely back at home ready for another party - once Xmas is over they are all NY parties, it is a big effort to get rid of the old and drink in the new!!!!!
Have now caught up with the news - having read all the NZ papers 1855-1870 that have name search facilities. I think I have all the Trewheellar (plus versions), Zingari and Tasmanian Maid references now, text and advertisements. Kept me out of the heat wave that has happened over the last 4 days.
My list for the Zingara fell a few short, but that is not surprising given the state of the arrivals records in NZ. No crew in that list, so no farther forward in Thomas's case (put the James down to an overheated brain cell - or more likely a missing one - same with the -ller/-llar that I sometimes mix). Wife Elizabeth almost certainly arrived on the "Melpomene" only a few weeks before she was married - Recorded as Miss Johns and Master Johns. I must check 12 year old Joshua's entry into school in Nelson.
The letters of the Owner of the Tasmanian Maid for the time in question are still extant, but study of them will have to wait until I travel north. I dont hold much hope to see the old Marine Dept. records as many (most) were burnt early last century. Tried once to get details of another boat, the Moutoa, that Thomas had for a short time - but all the references to it were missing from the files.
Received all your emails re excerpts in the British papers concerning the boats. I have all the NZ newspaper versions. Have read them now and it would make interesting study comparing the wording of the English and NZ texts, and some first hand accounts that reside in our libraries and museums. English bias is sometimes rampant. Present taxpayers are paying several million dollars now for the reparations.
The "Rotomahana" record is most interesting - it did a regular curcuit Wellington, Napier, Auckland, Russell, Sydney; returning I think to Wellington, so the Trewheellar's most likely boarded at Auckland.
Visitors have just arrived -with an OZ red - the weather has changed from calm, hot and dry, to windy, hot and muggy in the last half hour. Expecting a 15 degree drop in temp once the southerly hits us - unless it passes out to sea - Spring , Summer and Autumn over two hours!!!!
Cheers, all the best
NZJohn1
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Post by Cornish Terrier on Dec 31, 2008 13:43:41 GMT -5
Sounds like you have borrowed Melbourne for the day! ;D
A lot of interesting stuff involved here although I must say that I have not read yet through all the stuff I have found.
But the picture grows and gives us a better idea about Thomas.
Probably the most interesting thing I have gleaned from your latest is the information about Elizabeth JOHNS arrival.
That may well be a further clue about Thomas.
We know he must have been around Nelson for some time given the marriage took place at 'his home'.
But if Elizabeth arrived only weeks prior to the marriage then .....
That leads me to think that he had possibly not been in NZ for all that long or that he at least had regular voyages back home.
More food for thought.
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Post by kirill on Mar 2, 2009 2:57:30 GMT -5
Hello, let me provide you same information about my family Trewheller or in Russian version Truveller. At the beginning of 20 Th century in Omsk was living Boris Vladimirovich Truveller, not Michail. Wife Ekaterina Rachmanova. They had 5 children: Andrey 1899-1946 no kids Vasiliy 1901-1942 son Vladimir 1940-1998 no kids Vladimir 1904-1936 in 1922 moved from Vladivostok to Manila (Philippine) Ekaterina 1906-1944 no kids Boris 1913-1984. He had son Andrey 1938 – 3 kids: And daughter Natalie 1946
More information about our family in Russia you can find with searching word Truveller.
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